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 Post subject: Re: Star Citizen : open world space combat from Chris Roberts
PostPosted: Mon Aug 22, 2016 3:47 
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At times, Mr Turnip, you have a glorious turn of phrase.

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 Post subject: Re: Star Citizen : open world space combat from Chris Roberts
PostPosted: Mon Aug 22, 2016 8:47 
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As people may realise, I really don't like Star Citizen. They're preying on people, and that really gets my hackles up.

Long version:

ZOMG Spoiler! Click here to view!
The thing that truly baffles me about the cult that follows this game, is that this has all been seen before. I don't mean the game itself, I mean Chris Roberts' utter lack of direction and ability to manage a successful project from inception to completion.

The last game he was involved with prior to this one was Freelancer, which was basically sold as something akin to what Star Citizen is being sold as now, just not quite as advanced. The project famously kept running into delays and budgetary constraints, entirely because of Chris Roberts' "vision", which led in the end to his publishers, Microsoft, stepping in and essentially kicking him off the project (just keeping him in an "executive producer" role presumably to avoid some sort of lawsuit) and released a game that wasn't without its flaws, but was passable - it just wasn't quite what people were sold on.

With this game, they originally claimed that $3,000,000 would be enough to make the game that they envisaged during the Kickstarter phase. Then the money kept rolling in, and that all went south. Then the magic number was $65,000,000 needed to do everything. We're at $119,000,000 at the moment (last time I checked anyway) and nearly 5 years later all they have to show is a glorified CryEngine mod, and not a very good one at that. With every update, they add in features designed to make money - they sell ships for frankly ludicrous amounts of money, the ship they announced at GamesCom is for sale for a cool $250 - and that's one of the cheap ones, people have spent thousands of dollars on what are basically just JPEGs until they put them in the game.

The last update added clothing stores where you can kit your avatar out with clothes, in a similar vein to GTA4/5, but done somehow worse, and with a clear focus on paying real money to get clothes. This in a game where you currently can't walk around your ship without falling through the floor, or can glitch out through 90% of the walls that are supposed to contain you within the space station. Oh, and where if you go into hyperspace at a certain place, you get water splash effects on your screen, because CryEngine has a water layer on every map that they've just hidden and not bothered to work out how to disable properly*

Without a publisher to rein him in, Chris Roberts just keeps blathering away, waving his hands around and adding a huge amount of technical debt on to the development team in every interview. Almost every question asked about the game and what people can do it is met with a "yes" - "Can we go to the toilet on our spaceships?", "Yes."

And when you listen to interviews with him and the team, it's all about what they "hope to do", and "would like to have" in the game - there's basically no content in there after 5 years. Compare Chris Roberts' mushmouth with David Braben's interviews at GamesCom this year, and they're a world apart. One shows someone who doesn't really have a clue what's going on, the other one shows someone who clearly loves what they do (and yes, I'm a bit of a Braben fanboi :P)

* They apparently spent months trying to work out why their ship handling was off in certain parts of their "world" - they'd be flying along and would just suddenly change course and slow down. Eventually someone realised that the water layer was still there, so the ships were literally flying into what the physics engine considered to be water and reacting accordingly.


TL;DR: This is a gigantic scam, with more focus on raising money than actually making a game. Avoid.

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 Post subject: Re: Star Citizen : open world space combat from Chris Roberts
PostPosted: Mon Aug 22, 2016 9:16 
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I agree with Gaz. Star Citizen is shady as shit.


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 Post subject: Re: Space Citizen: open world space combat from Chris Roberts
PostPosted: Mon Aug 22, 2016 9:22 
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Grim... wrote:
So, Star Citizen have promised to make up some alien language(s) if they get $50,000,000 in pre-orders.

They are currently on $48m.

Forty-eight. Million.
Consider this post, which was made in July 2014. The initial Kickstarter was October 2012, so it was already almost two years in when Grim... posted. That was two years ago; since then, it's raised a further $71m and changed its terms of service to remove a clause that granted refunds if the game was more than eighteen months late.

Grim... wrote:
There's simply no reason for them to actually release this game - the money just keeps pouring in.
Prescient.


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 Post subject: Re: Star Citizen : open world space combat from Chris Roberts
PostPosted: Mon Aug 22, 2016 9:40 
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https://robertsspaceindustries.com/pled ... st-Digital

$18,000 for a set of ships and other stuff!

The blurb for this starts off with "Need to have it all?"

Then half way down tells you that $18,000 is not enough for a Javelin Destroyer ship to be included, but don't worry once you have shelled the money out for this pack then the ability to spend more on a Javelin Destroyer will be unlocked!


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 Post subject: Re: Star Citizen : open world space combat from Chris Roberts
PostPosted: Mon Aug 22, 2016 9:54 
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Unpossible!

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EIGHTEEN FUCKING THOUSAND DOLLARS?

Of real actual folding real-world money?

And people are actually falling for this shit?


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 Post subject: Re: Star Citizen : open world space combat from Chris Roberts
PostPosted: Mon Aug 22, 2016 10:34 
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Paws for thought

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If you can find someone who bought it for $18000, then yes, people are actually falling for that shit.

Otherwise, probably not.


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 Post subject: Re: Star Citizen : open world space combat from Chris Roberts
PostPosted: Mon Aug 22, 2016 11:34 
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On the original Kick Starter page one person did buy a $10,000 donation package.


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 Post subject: Re: Star Citizen : open world space combat from Chris Roberts
PostPosted: Mon Aug 22, 2016 11:37 
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Mr Dave wrote:
If you can find someone who bought it for $18000, then yes, people are actually falling for that shit.

Otherwise, probably not.

There are people on their forums that are in for over $30,000 - and are proud of it.

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 Post subject: Re: Star Citizen : open world space combat from Chris Roberts
PostPosted: Mon Aug 22, 2016 11:40 
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I am sorry, I thought you said $30,000 for a game?

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 Post subject: Re: Star Citizen : open world space combat from Chris Roberts
PostPosted: Mon Aug 22, 2016 11:48 
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No, 30k gets you some ship models, there is no game.

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 Post subject: Re: Star Citizen : open world space combat from Chris Roberts
PostPosted: Mon Aug 22, 2016 11:49 
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gooby pls

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Bobbyaro wrote:
No, 30k gets you some ship JPEGs, there is no game.

FeEx.

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 Post subject: Re: Star Citizen : open world space combat from Chris Roberts
PostPosted: Mon Aug 22, 2016 11:57 
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Wow....

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 Post subject: Re: Star Citizen : open world space combat from Chris Roberts
PostPosted: Mon Aug 22, 2016 12:57 
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Paws for thought

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GazChap wrote:
Mr Dave wrote:
If you can find someone who bought it for $18000, then yes, people are actually falling for that shit.

Otherwise, probably not.

There are people on their forums that are in for over $30,000 - and are proud of it.

Any evidence that they actually have? It's easy to pretend you have excess money.


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 Post subject: Re: Star Citizen : open world space combat from Chris Roberts
PostPosted: Mon Aug 22, 2016 13:24 
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No evidence that doesn't come from CIG/RSI, which immediately makes me dubious.

Still, assuming the funding tracker is true, the money is coming from somewhere.

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 Post subject: Re: Star Citizen : open world space combat from Chris Roberts
PostPosted: Mon Aug 22, 2016 13:27 
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GazChap wrote:
No evidence that doesn't come from CIG/RSI, which immediately makes me dubious.

Still, assuming the funding tracker is true, the money is coming from somewhere.


If you trust the funding trackers. It's like the gpu monitoring apps people use that under report on the 3 weeks leading up to the launch of a new card so their 63fps goes down to 59.....

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 Post subject: Re: Star Citizen : open world space combat from Chris Roberts
PostPosted: Mon Aug 22, 2016 14:26 
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The Game footage they showed looked really good. So not sure I understand why people say the game at present is so shit??


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 Post subject: Re: Star Citizen : open world space combat from Chris Roberts
PostPosted: Mon Aug 22, 2016 14:29 
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I guess that the developers can make even a bug-riddled mess of a game look ok by knowing how to avoid all the bugs. But as someone pretty ingorant of the whole thing I agree it looked stunning in that demo.


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 Post subject: Re: Star Citizen : open world space combat from Chris Roberts
PostPosted: Mon Aug 22, 2016 14:30 
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asfish wrote:
The Game footage they showed looked really good. So not sure I understand why people say the game at present is so shit??

It's a mystery.
GazChap wrote:
This in a game where you currently can't walk around your ship without falling through the floor, or can glitch out through 90% of the walls that are supposed to contain you within the space station. Oh, and where if you go into hyperspace at a certain place, you get water splash effects on your screen, because CryEngine has a water layer on every map that they've just hidden and not bothered to work out how to disable properly
I guess we'll never really know.


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 Post subject: Re: Star Citizen : open world space combat from Chris Roberts
PostPosted: Mon Aug 22, 2016 14:42 
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gooby pls

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asfish wrote:
The Game footage they showed looked really good. So not sure I understand why people say the game at present is so shit??

See also: Aliens - Colonial Marines.

See: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pb9p_xzaNjU

Also, at GamesCom (where they announced this cool video) they had a booth setup that had 6 monitors that were used by their Twitch streamers to stream the game to the world at large. They were streaming Alpha version 2.4, because Alpha version 2.5 is reportedly a massive step backwards from the "quality" (and I use that term loosely) in 2.4.

Their entire booth at GamesCom was basically fenced off from the public so that Joe Public couldn't see how bad the game was in it's current state. Even on the Twitch streams they kept having to turn them off while they reset the game and reinstalled it and stuff.

If they had a game that was any good, why wouldn't they be streaming THAT version?

It's an absolute fucking shambles and I'm amazed that they've raised nearly $120,000,000 off this shit.

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 Post subject: Re: Star Citizen : open world space combat from Chris Roberts
PostPosted: Mon Aug 22, 2016 15:16 
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Hope that they do end up releasing something that looks like their "promotion footage"

Looking at this and you wonder if $120 million is enough?


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_m ... to_develop


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 Post subject: Re: Star Citizen : open world space combat from Chris Roberts
PostPosted: Mon Aug 22, 2016 15:25 
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If you're a small studio crowdfunding a game, then yes, raising enough money to come in the top 10 most expensive games of all time is absolutely bloody enough.

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 Post subject: Re: Star Citizen : open world space combat from Chris Roberts
PostPosted: Mon Aug 22, 2016 15:26 
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I thought it was quite good fun when I tried it. Although I didn't fall through my ship.

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 Post subject: Re: Star Citizen : open world space combat from Chris Roberts
PostPosted: Mon Aug 22, 2016 15:40 
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Cras wrote:
If you're a small studio crowdfunding a game, then yes, raising enough money to come in the top 10 most expensive games of all time is absolutely bloody enough.


What's more, in terms of pure development cost, it's currently 4th most expensive. And development hasn't finished yet.

Christ knows what was happening with The Old Republic. Holding their stand-ups on Endor or something.


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 Post subject: Re: Star Citizen : open world space combat from Chris Roberts
PostPosted: Mon Aug 22, 2016 16:37 
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gooby pls

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Cras wrote:
If you're a small studio crowdfunding a game, then yes, raising enough money to come in the top 10 most expensive games of all time is absolutely bloody enough.

The irony is, they're not a small studio any more - they have over 400 employees by most accounts, spread across four offices across the globe.

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 Post subject: Re: Star Citizen : open world space combat from Chris Roberts
PostPosted: Mon Aug 22, 2016 16:40 
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I'm not surprised - they've got 120 million bucks to burn ;)

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 Post subject: Re: Star Citizen : open world space combat from Chris Roberts
PostPosted: Mon Aug 22, 2016 18:15 
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So apparently the website I visited (which was probably Eurogamer, but I don't remember) was confused when it stated that the game was due for release at the end of this year. It is the Alpha 3 (which was what was demoed) that is due for release at that point according to RPS, which makes a lot more sense.


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 Post subject: Re: Star Citizen : open world space combat from Chris Roberts
PostPosted: Sun Nov 18, 2018 12:57 
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It's just broken the $200m barrier.

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 Post subject: Re: Star Citizen : open world space combat from Chris Roberts
PostPosted: Sun Nov 18, 2018 13:52 
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Money well spent...


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 Post subject: Re: Star Citizen : open world space combat from Chris Roberts
PostPosted: Sun Nov 18, 2018 14:03 
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Looking back, last time I tried this was about 3 years ago... I'll download it again and see what's up!

edit : thinking about it, I also have a free copy of destiny 2 to play too, I guess I know what my sunday is going to be. I was almost bored enough to buy a PSVR, but that can wait now...


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 Post subject: Re: Star Citizen : open world space combat from Chris Roberts
PostPosted: Sun Nov 18, 2018 14:29 
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Don't play Destiny 2, it's a turd.

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 Post subject: Re: Star Citizen : open world space combat from Chris Roberts
PostPosted: Sun Nov 18, 2018 14:44 
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Cras wrote:
Don't play Destiny 2, it's a turd.


Free turd though, best kind of turd.


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 Post subject: Re: Star Citizen : open world space combat from Chris Roberts
PostPosted: Sun Nov 18, 2018 18:11 
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Star citizen. 2 minutes in and I turned it off in disgust. £200m seems to have been spent on making choosing how to invert your Y axis as complicated as possible.

There isn't an invert Y button, there are literally 50+ different toggles for inversion of everything, across all possible concurrent control schemes (mouse, joystick, keyboard, gamepad). Each of them is a compounded tree where you can select inversion for FPS mode, flight mode, hangar mode, turret mode, ground vehicle mode, free look mode, walking mode and some other modes. Select inversion for any of those modes and it inverts everything. X axis too... So you have to drill down into each and invert the Y axis for each mode individually, but it's not called Y axis, it's called pitch, or view, or something else dependent on the mode you are in. And you have to repeat the same exercise for each control method.
So I did all that, took ages, game crashed coming out of the control menu and starting it up again it has lost all the settings...
So I do it all again, get it setup right. Didn't crash this time! Start the game by going into my hangar... the x axis is inverted, even though I told it not to be...

Turned off the game and gave up, what a load of shit.


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 Post subject: Re: Star Citizen : open world space combat from Chris Roberts
PostPosted: Sun Nov 18, 2018 18:22 
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Trooper wrote:
edit : thinking about it, I also have a free copy of destiny 2 to play too, I guess I know what my sunday is going to be. I was almost bored enough to buy a PSVR, but that can wait now...


Apparently it's a lot better now, Bungie have really sorted it out by all accounts.

I got a free copy with the 1080 in Mrs Hearthly's new PC, I've got it all installed and ready to go. Haven't played it yet likes.....

Well, I did fire it up to see if my PC can run it at native 4K at 60FPS (which it can, just about, with a couple of settings dropped down a notch). My graphics card didn't know what'd hit it, poor thing only has to do Hearthstone and fruit machine emulators normally. The fans were like, what's this shit, you want me to spin now?

I'll actually try playing it at some point, probably.

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