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 Post subject: Re: General Election 2017
PostPosted: Tue Jun 06, 2017 9:37 
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MaliA wrote:
Boris was being an absolute twat on R4 this morning. Horrid.


Didn't hear it. Was he trying to avoid awkward questions about security, Mr Trump, and the missing £350 million?


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 Post subject: Re: General Election 2017
PostPosted: Tue Jun 06, 2017 9:43 
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Comfortably Dumb

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In town yesterday, I could see more people than usual sheltering from the crappy weather. I could see that some of them were campaigners of some sort, but didn't think too much of it. Turns out it was Steve Coogan doing his bit for Labour.

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 Post subject: Re: General Election 2017
PostPosted: Tue Jun 06, 2017 10:02 
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MaliA wrote:
Boris was being an absolute twat on R4 this morning. Horrid.

"People are fed up of this freedom of speech stuff."


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 Post subject: Re: General Election 2017
PostPosted: Tue Jun 06, 2017 10:21 
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"Increasing police numbers only takes the focus off blaming the criminals."


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 Post subject: Re: General Election 2017
PostPosted: Tue Jun 06, 2017 13:36 
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Two heads are better than one

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 Post subject: Re: General Election 2017
PostPosted: Tue Jun 06, 2017 13:58 
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Unpossible!

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Superb.


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 Post subject: Re: General Election 2017
PostPosted: Tue Jun 06, 2017 14:03 
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Gogmagog

Joined: 30th Mar, 2008
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Brilliant

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 Post subject: Re: General Election 2017
PostPosted: Wed Jun 07, 2017 11:02 
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Kern wrote:
The Oxford Mail clearly hasn't run out of election stories:

Residents outraged after Tory posters vandalised

I always thought that playful defacement or removal of candidates' signs was fair game at election time, akin to a form of fox-hunting.


This is clearly the biggest election news in the old city:

'Jubilant' young woman spotted tearing down Conservative posters before jumping in getaway car

Where's Inspector Morse when you need him, eh?


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 Post subject: Re: General Election 2017
PostPosted: Wed Jun 07, 2017 13:32 
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Prince of Fops

Joined: 14th May, 2009
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Kern wrote:
Kern wrote:
The Oxford Mail clearly hasn't run out of election stories:

Residents outraged after Tory posters vandalised

I always thought that playful defacement or removal of candidates' signs was fair game at election time, akin to a form of fox-hunting.


This is clearly the biggest election news in the old city:

'Jubilant' young woman spotted tearing down Conservative posters before jumping in getaway car

Where's Inspector Morse when you need him, eh?


A vote for Labour is a vote for jubilance.


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 Post subject: Re: General Election 2017
PostPosted: Wed Jun 07, 2017 13:41 
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Gogmagog

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This "remove human rights laws" stuff has really irked me. Like the death penalty, people who side with it never want justice, they want revenge.

The UK is really good, generally: we've got universal healthcare, education, an independent judiciary, and we've put equal rights into law, along with human rights. The government has said "OK, UK, you crack on and don't be a dick, and we'll do the same, but if we do, then there's this lot to sort us both out". And removing these laws makes it less great.

Keir Starmer was brilliant on R4 this morning, on it.

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 Post subject: Re: General Election 2017
PostPosted: Wed Jun 07, 2017 13:45 
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Gogmagog

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Oops.


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 Post subject: Re: General Election 2017
PostPosted: Wed Jun 07, 2017 13:52 
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MaliA wrote:
This "remove human rights laws" stuff has really irked me. Like the death penalty, people who side with it never want justice, they want revenge.

The UK is really good, generally: we've got universal healthcare, education, an independent judiciary, and we've put equal rights into law, along with human rights. The government has said "OK, UK, you crack on and don't be a dick, and we'll do the same, but if we do, then there's this lot to sort us both out". And removing these laws makes it less great.


Very much agreed. I got really angry when Mrs May started up on this again, and all the criticisms come from easily debunkable misunderstandings or myths but still people come out with them. Gah. Next up: bendy bananas and social workers claiming a TV is a sideboard.

I'd be more inclined to listen if they based their opposition to it on some form of political theory argument regarding the differences between common law and civil law regarding natural rights and the role of the state. But the only person I know who does that is an old uni friend of mine who got a first in philosophy and he's not a candidate or pundit.


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 Post subject: Re: General Election 2017
PostPosted: Wed Jun 07, 2017 13:52 
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MaliA wrote:
Oops.


Jubilant?


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 Post subject: Re: General Election 2017
PostPosted: Wed Jun 07, 2017 13:56 
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Gogmagog

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Kern wrote:
MaliA wrote:
Oops.


Jubilant?


They're being put on people's door handles if they are out, apparently. Labour whining aside, I can see a point, but it isn't terrible.

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 Post subject: Re: General Election 2017
PostPosted: Wed Jun 07, 2017 17:34 
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Suppose I'd better take down the map that's been up in my mancave since May 2015.


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 Post subject: Re: General Election 2017
PostPosted: Wed Jun 07, 2017 20:42 
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Prince of Fops

Joined: 14th May, 2009
Posts: 4300
This seems like a good deal to me:

20/1 May to be PM on Ladbrokes

So £200 down, £4k back. Or if she's not PM, I'll be £200 poorer, but a very happy man.

And if she's not PM, the money comes back as a free bet.

Am I missing something here? Seems too good to be true.

Edit - ah no, I'm an idiot. Maximum bet £1. Can't be bothered signing up for that.


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 Post subject: Re: General Election 2017
PostPosted: Wed Jun 07, 2017 21:06 
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Soopah red DS

Joined: 2nd Jun, 2008
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I did sign up. Process was painful - quick sign up via PayPal didn't work for me (but I thought it had - then had to fill in all my details and make a deposit). The bet still shows as 1/6, too, with a return of £1.17, though there's a whole load of text stating it is 20/1 (was 1/6). We'll see.


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 Post subject: Re: General Election 2017
PostPosted: Wed Jun 07, 2017 21:17 
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Gogmagog

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Put my money where my mouth is.


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 Post subject: Re: General Election 2017
PostPosted: Wed Jun 07, 2017 21:18 
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MaliA wrote:
This "remove human rights laws" stuff has really irked me. Like the death penalty, people who side with it never want justice, they want revenge.


Yep, there's a real lynch mob mentality out there at the moment.
It was announced that the 12 people arrested in London had all been released without charge and there were hordes of people demanding that they be kicked out of the country, imprisoned for life or killed!


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 Post subject: Re: General Election 2017
PostPosted: Thu Jun 08, 2017 2:09 
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Can you dig it?

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Dr Zoidberg wrote:
Yep, there's a real lynch mob mentality out there at the moment.


Yes, I have been quite dismayed by a few FB postings I've seen - particularly from Lady T's sister and hubby. I don't like to unfriend or unfollow as I generally like to see some opposing viewpoints. But they are spouting so much bollocks, so much vitriol. It's quite upsetting to see so many people like this.

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 Post subject: Re: General Election 2017
PostPosted: Thu Jun 08, 2017 6:59 
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I'm at the polling station, 3rd in line, counting down to DEMOCRACY


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 Post subject: Re: General Election 2017
PostPosted: Thu Jun 08, 2017 7:06 
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Voted. I was seventh in the queue.

[Insert Hogarth photo here]


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 Post subject: Re: General Election 2017
PostPosted: Thu Jun 08, 2017 8:04 
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Russell and I always used to try to get first in line and then have breakfast out before arriving to work at 8, but I'm going at a more relaxed pace today and Darwin and I will have a toddle down to the polling station after breakfast and once we are both fully dressed for the weather :)

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 Post subject: Re: General Election 2017
PostPosted: Thu Jun 08, 2017 8:10 
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I like the idea of an election breakfast. The pub opposite the usual polling station doesn't open until noon, alas, and stopped serving food recently.


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 Post subject: Re: General Election 2017
PostPosted: Thu Jun 08, 2017 8:12 
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And I will be voting after work to do my bit.

I genuinely think voting should be mandatory; perhaps they should have postal ballots by default.

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 Post subject: Re: General Election 2017
PostPosted: Thu Jun 08, 2017 8:16 
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Kern wrote:
[Insert Hogarth photo here]


Ah, here it is:

North-east Oxfordshire, this morning:
Image

Some background on these paintings:
History Today
Wikipedia


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 Post subject: Re: General Election 2017
PostPosted: Thu Jun 08, 2017 8:16 
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Prince of Fops

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Mr Russell wrote:
And I will be voting after work to do my bit.

I genuinely think voting should be mandatory; perhaps they should have postal ballots by default.


I postal voted for the first time this year. It's great. However, all that faffing with sticking one section in Envelope A, another in Envelope B, ensuring the right bit is showing through the envelope panel, and then getting the correct envelope in the other envelope, without covering up the correct address. I genuinely think that level of intellectual gymnastics would be beyond large swathes of our country.


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 Post subject: Re: General Election 2017
PostPosted: Thu Jun 08, 2017 8:19 
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Mr Russell wrote:
And I will be voting after work to do my bit.

I genuinely think voting should be mandatory; perhaps they should have postal ballots by default.

We live in a free democracy where people are free to vote for whom they choose (or not). Forced voting is authoritarianism that I would not support.

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 Post subject: Re: General Election 2017
PostPosted: Thu Jun 08, 2017 8:20 
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Findus Fop wrote:
Mr Russell wrote:
And I will be voting after work to do my bit.

I genuinely think voting should be mandatory; perhaps they should have postal ballots by default.


I postal voted for the first time this year. It's great. However, all that faffing with sticking one section in Envelope A, another in Envelope B, ensuring the right bit is showing through the envelope panel, and then getting the correct envelope in the other envelope, without covering up the correct address. I genuinely think that level of intellectual gymnastics would be beyond large swathes of our country.

I didn't know any of that, having never voted by post, but it does sound more complicated than it needs to be.

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 Post subject: Re: General Election 2017
PostPosted: Thu Jun 08, 2017 8:20 
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Lonewolves wrote:
Mr Russell wrote:
And I will be voting after work to do my bit.

I genuinely think voting should be mandatory; perhaps they should have postal ballots by default.

We live in a free democracy where people are free to vote for whom they choose (or not). Forced voting is authoritarianism that I would not support.

Even if under such a system there would be a None Of The Above and/or Refuse To Vote option?

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 Post subject: Re: General Election 2017
PostPosted: Thu Jun 08, 2017 8:20 
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Gogmagog

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Findus Fop wrote:
Mr Russell wrote:
And I will be voting after work to do my bit.

I genuinely think voting should be mandatory; perhaps they should have postal ballots by default.


I postal voted for the first time this year. It's great. However, all that faffing with sticking one section in Envelope A, another in Envelope B, ensuring the right bit is showing through the envelope panel, and then getting the correct envelope in the other envelope, without covering up the correct address. I genuinely think that level of intellectual gymnastics would be beyond large swathes of our country.


Not in Bradford

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 Post subject: Re: General Election 2017
PostPosted: Thu Jun 08, 2017 8:21 
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Findus Fop wrote:
I genuinely think that level of intellectual gymnastics would be beyond large swathes of our country.


I'm more worried about the risk to the secrecy of the ballot that goes with postal voting. Being able to vote in a booth, by yourself, is the only way we can know you're doing so freely and without intimidation.

I understand the point of mandatory voting, but I'm against it because I think it's a civic duty you should do willingly.


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 Post subject: Re: General Election 2017
PostPosted: Thu Jun 08, 2017 8:27 
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MaliA wrote:
Findus Fop wrote:
Mr Russell wrote:
And I will be voting after work to do my bit.

I genuinely think voting should be mandatory; perhaps they should have postal ballots by default.


I postal voted for the first time this year. It's great. However, all that faffing with sticking one section in Envelope A, another in Envelope B, ensuring the right bit is showing through the envelope panel, and then getting the correct envelope in the other envelope, without covering up the correct address. I genuinely think that level of intellectual gymnastics would be beyond large swathes of our country.


Not in Bradford

Yeah, that's definitely one problem with postal or internet voting, how to ensure that everyone actually gets to make their own choice.


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 Post subject: Re: General Election 2017
PostPosted: Thu Jun 08, 2017 8:28 
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Gogmagog

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Lonewolves wrote:
Mr Russell wrote:
And I will be voting after work to do my bit.

I genuinely think voting should be mandatory; perhaps they should have postal ballots by default.

We live in a free democracy where people are free to vote for whom they choose (or not). Forced voting is authoritarianism that I would not support.


Oh, christ. I agree with myp.

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 Post subject: Re: General Election 2017
PostPosted: Thu Jun 08, 2017 8:30 
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The realistic outcome of a non-forced voting system however is that the country's future is decided by selfish narrow-minded old people, because they're the ones that turn out.

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 Post subject: Re: General Election 2017
PostPosted: Thu Jun 08, 2017 8:40 
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Unpossible!

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They should hold the election in the winter, on a Saturday.


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 Post subject: Re: General Election 2017
PostPosted: Thu Jun 08, 2017 8:43 
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DavPaz wrote:
They should hold the election in the winter, on a Saturday.


I'd be up for weekend voting. Or at the very least make it a bank holiday.


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 Post subject: Re: General Election 2017
PostPosted: Thu Jun 08, 2017 8:48 
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MaliA wrote:
Oh, christ. I agree with myp.


Pollsters call it 'Shy Myppism'


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 Post subject: Re: General Election 2017
PostPosted: Thu Jun 08, 2017 8:54 
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Cras wrote:
The realistic outcome of a non-forced voting system however is that the country's future is decided by selfish narrow-minded old people, because they're the ones that turn out.

On the other hand, in a forced voting system (which I don't support, in shock "agrees with myp" news) what's to say that the young wouldn't just turn out but spoil their ballot/refuse to vote/vote none of the above or whatever in protest to being forced to vote?


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 Post subject: Re: General Election 2017
PostPosted: Thu Jun 08, 2017 9:02 
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Don't feel shy agreeing with me! I'm brilliant

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 Post subject: Re: General Election 2017
PostPosted: Thu Jun 08, 2017 9:13 
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I drove past a polling station this morning (not in my constituency) and who I can only assume was the Lib Dem candidate (or a supporter, at least) was stood outside the polling station - directly outside the entrance - wearing a yellow rosette.

I thought wearing political symbols etc. like that was illegal when in/outside a polling station on election day?


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 Post subject: Re: General Election 2017
PostPosted: Thu Jun 08, 2017 9:14 
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GazChap wrote:
Cras wrote:
The realistic outcome of a non-forced voting system however is that the country's future is decided by selfish narrow-minded old people, because they're the ones that turn out.

On the other hand, in a forced voting system (which I don't support, in shock "agrees with myp" news) what's to say that the young wouldn't just turn out but spoil their ballot/refuse to vote/vote none of the above or whatever in protest to being forced to vote?

Well that's the idea, but at least then you have an idea of how many people are actively disengaged with politics rather than passively disengaged.

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 Post subject: Re: General Election 2017
PostPosted: Thu Jun 08, 2017 9:15 
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What do people reckon then? I reckon that the Tories will gain about 30 seats or so.


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 Post subject: Re: General Election 2017
PostPosted: Thu Jun 08, 2017 9:16 
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GazChap wrote:
I drove past a polling station this morning (not in my constituency) and who I can only assume was the Lib Dem candidate (or a supporter, at least) was stood outside the polling station - directly outside the entrance - wearing a yellow rosette.

I thought wearing political symbols etc. like that was illegal when in/outside a polling station on election day?


I think they can't enter the station itself but they can be outside so long as they're not blocking it. Which reminds me: remember you are not obliged to give your electoral number to anyone outside.


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 Post subject: Re: General Election 2017
PostPosted: Thu Jun 08, 2017 9:16 
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markg wrote:
What do people reckon then? I reckon that the Tories will gain about 30 seats or so.


Tory majority of 50-60ish.


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 Post subject: Re: General Election 2017
PostPosted: Thu Jun 08, 2017 9:18 
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sneering elitist

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GazChap wrote:
Cras wrote:
The realistic outcome of a non-forced voting system however is that the country's future is decided by selfish narrow-minded old people, because they're the ones that turn out.

On the other hand, in a forced voting system (which I don't support, in shock "agrees with myp" news) what's to say that the young wouldn't just turn out but spoil their ballot/refuse to vote/vote none of the above or whatever in protest to being forced to vote?


But, as I said last night, that's better than not voting at all.

At least when you spoil your paper (although it's not something I personally agree with, surely there is always a "least worst" candidate?) you're saying "everything sucks, you don't represent me!" - when you don't show up you're saying "I'm a lazy apathetic twat".

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 Post subject: Re: General Election 2017
PostPosted: Thu Jun 08, 2017 9:19 
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Tory majority of 50+

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 Post subject: Re: General Election 2017
PostPosted: Thu Jun 08, 2017 9:23 
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Spoiling your ballot is an utter waste of time. I know we talk about this every time, but they are never counted as part of official statistics. So those writing 'none of the above' protest votes are treated in the same way as someone accidentally crossing two candidates.

But whatever makes you feel good, I guess.

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 Post subject: Re: General Election 2017
PostPosted: Thu Jun 08, 2017 9:25 
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Lonewolves wrote:
Spoiling your ballot is an utter waste of time. I know we talk about this every time, but they are never counted as part of official statistics. So those writing 'none of the above' protest votes are treated in the same way as someone accidentally crossing two candidates.

But whatever makes you feel good, I guess.

Under the current system, yes.

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 Post subject: Re: General Election 2017
PostPosted: Thu Jun 08, 2017 9:28 
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Are the #usepens twats active this year?


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