Heck of a lot of Russian troops holidaying just outside Ukraine right now. Wonder if Putin will risk going for the seasonal surprise?
I am sure that Truss has this in hand.
It's all trussed up
Just think how much the UK's influence over these situations could be amplified if as well as using military pressures being a leading part of a large alliance, they could also use economic pressures through some large European economic organisation.
https://twitter.com/MaliciousA/status/1 ... 4672750595
Liz Truss did her best https://t.co/oJ7IAEETBr
— MaliciousA (@MaliciousA) February 11, 2022
In Liz we truss
My favourite gag about Liz Truss and her blunderous makeover is about the wistful photo ops in Moscow.
Some wag said she misheard Dominic Raab’s reply when she told him she was going to Moscow. She thought he said “Wear the fox hat”
Some wag said she misheard Dominic Raab’s reply when she told him she was going to Moscow. She thought he said “Wear the fox hat”
Russia has officially declared war and started a full scale invasion.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/world-europe-60454795
Can we get the thread title changed, as it doesn’t feel so funny any more.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/world-europe-60454795
Can we get the thread title changed, as it doesn’t feel so funny any more.
Russia's declared war? I thought they very much had not done that
I thought that changed this morning?
It has indeed.
No actual, formal "Declaration of War" though, right? None of the proper diplomatic procedures, just rocking over the border with a chunk of tanks and trucks.
Squirt wrote:
No actual, formal "Declaration of War" though, right? None of the proper diplomatic procedures, just rocking over the border with a chunk of tanks and trucks.
Yes, this is what I meant. Putin is supposedly 'liberating' the area, not declaring war on Ukraine
Correct. Technically Russia hasn't declared war. Just like technically Boris hasn't said he is a bellend, regardless of what everyone knows to be true.
I don't know what difference that actually makes in the grand scheme of things though. Maybe some legal impact somewhere along the line, but there's a de facto war going on.
War is still technically illegal under UN law, so as the word is never used. 'Conflict', 'incursion' and 'security operation' are fine. Anyway, feeling absolutely gutted. As of two weeks ago I felt confident it could be resolved through the dragging out of diplomacy, and I'm usually the pessimist in the house.
One thing's for sure if this doesn't finally convince us and the rest of Europe to being putting the flesh back on the bones of our military, I'm not sure what will. I'm feeling desperately sad for the Ukraine, and my Polish friends are understandably nervous.
One thing's for sure if this doesn't finally convince us and the rest of Europe to being putting the flesh back on the bones of our military, I'm not sure what will. I'm feeling desperately sad for the Ukraine, and my Polish friends are understandably nervous.
Not sure what's going to stop him now really. Unless the Ukranians end up fighting in the streets and the Russian bodies begin piling up. Is this the end of the era of peace brought about by nuclear weapons? Because that only really works if everyone is behaving somewhat rationally.
Well it works better if you don't give all your nuclear weapons to your neighbour on the promise that they won't invade you.
Looks like a helicopter assault on the airport outside of Kiev. Several helicopters have been downed. You don't do that for laughs so I expect they were probably landing ground forces before an armoured drive down to Kiev gets there. It doesn't look as if the Russian forces have had an entirely easy time of it yet. There's some footage of a wrecked tank with its turret popped off and some hit APCs. Also footage of jets duelling. That's about as much as I had the stomach to watch right now.
If you were not already freaked out there is currently fighting around Chernobyl with the Russians trying to seize control of the ruins
**edit **
I may only be fooling myself but this story does make it sound less worrying to me :
https://www.newscientist.com/article/23 ... chernobyl/
**edit **
I may only be fooling myself but this story does make it sound less worrying to me :
https://www.newscientist.com/article/23 ... chernobyl/
Nice tactic after they left Ukraine with the debt for removing and cleaning up the site. Wonder how the companies who are still expecting payment on the 10billion dolllareydos feel now.
zaphod79 wrote:
If you were not already freaked out there is currently fighting around Chernobyl with the Russians trying to seize control of the ruins
**edit **
I may only be fooling myself but this story does make it sound less worrying to me :
https://www.newscientist.com/article/23 ... chernobyl/
**edit **
I may only be fooling myself but this story does make it sound less worrying to me :
https://www.newscientist.com/article/23 ... chernobyl/
If they end up having to retreat, I would expect Russia to lob some explosives that way out of spite.
Spent the last 2 days following the situation with mix of horror and despondency.
About the only glimpse of hope is how much solidarity there is with the Ukrainians right now.
I don't have much else to add, other than to get angry about reports that the government aren't making it easy for Ukrainians to get to safety in the UK.
About the only glimpse of hope is how much solidarity there is with the Ukrainians right now.
I don't have much else to add, other than to get angry about reports that the government aren't making it easy for Ukrainians to get to safety in the UK.
There’s a small chance that the Ukrainians might put up a strong enough defence to make Putin think twice about continuing. I don’t think they were expecting so many civilians to take up arms.
Have to wonder how into it all the Russian army are as well if the fighting gets drawn out.
If anyone wants to stare into the abyss of utter utter loathsomeness.
War as a spectator sport. (via MrDave)
War as a spectator sport. (via MrDave)
Probably sponsored by World of Tanks
I am getting the impression that Russia isn't getting very far with this campaign. However, I am slightly suspicious of the news given the attitude towards Russia and Ukraine's underdog status leading to more positive coverage
It’s definitely not a quick and easy victory. They could start launching huge amounts of artillery into cities, but that would remove any pretence that they are liberating Ukraine. It’s pretty clear that the Ukrainians have far better resolve and motivation, and the amount of modern anti-tank and anti-air weapons they are getting must make a big difference. The sanctions are also more united and wide ranging than seemed likely.
Hopefully they’ll agree to talks soon, and Putin will see some sort of sense.
Hopefully they’ll agree to talks soon, and Putin will see some sort of sense.
In a slightly worrying development, Putin seems to have just said that if he's not allowed to take Ukraine, he might just nuke the planet.
I can just hear the chants through the post nuclear strike rubble of "We're more important than you" from Leeds if it gets cooked and Manchester gets overlooked.
This continues to be horrific and disturbing, with no obvious good ending in sight.
Yeah it's awful. Nothing to stop the cunt at all. However bravely they fight I think they're completely fucked.
It's simply awful and horrific. I'm functioning at the moment by restricting myself to ten minutes of news in the early morning at most and just trying for every distraction during the day for sake of mental health. So expect some distracting but safe content momentarily from me as I try to turn my mind to other things.
Yeah,
There's been a couple of days, where I was doom scrolling, and It wasn't good for me. So I also try to limit it to the morning, and I might watch the news in the evening. But I try to keep it at that.
There's been a couple of days, where I was doom scrolling, and It wasn't good for me. So I also try to limit it to the morning, and I might watch the news in the evening. But I try to keep it at that.
My ploys of playing Plague Tale: Innocence and XCOM2 are not proving to be the diversion from death, horror, and global warfare that I'd hoped.
NervousPete wrote:
It's simply awful and horrific. I'm functioning at the moment by restricting myself to ten minutes of news in the early morning at most and just trying for every distraction during the day for sake of mental health. So expect some distracting but safe content momentarily from me as I try to turn my mind to other things.
I’m doing the same, but I find it most helpful to look at the news for just ten minutes just after I’ve eaten lunch. If I look in the morning it throws my entire day off course and I find it hard to pull away from that feeling of doom. If I look in the evening I don’t sleep. But after lunch the feeling that I am warm, safe and alert and have food in my tummy keeps me calm, so I can read the news, try to understand things, and then I can put it down and move on with my next task.
Findus Fop wrote:
My ploys of playing Plague Tale: Innocence and XCOM2 are not proving to be the diversion from death, horror, and global warfare that I'd hoped.
Gran Turismo 7 arrived today, which may be more relaxing than the post apocalyptic scenes of Horizon: Forbidden West
Saw a couple of B-52s chug over head when out walking the dog. Looked up their flightpath on the interweb and they had just come back from flying round and round and round in Romania for about 5 hours. I guess they were showing thay they're ready to go if needed.
Or… they we’re looking for the looove getawaaaaay.
I watched this the other week, it hasn't left me.
WARNING - Despite being a made-for-TV film from 1984, it's utterly harrowing so if you've never seen it before and decide to do so, please be aware of that.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Threads_(1984_film)
Threads is a 1984 British apocalyptic war drama television film jointly produced by the BBC, Nine Network and Western-World Television Inc. Written by Barry Hines and directed and produced by Mick Jackson,[2][3] it is a dramatic account of nuclear war and its effects in Britain, specifically on the city of Sheffield in Northern England. The plot centres on two families as a confrontation between the United States and the Soviet Union erupts. As the nuclear exchange between NATO and the Warsaw Pact begins, the film depicts the medical, economic, social and environmental consequences of nuclear war.[4]
Shot on a budget of £400,000, the film was the first of its kind to depict a nuclear winter. It has been called "a film which comes closest to representing the full horror of nuclear war and its aftermath, as well as the catastrophic impact that the event would have on human culture."[5] It has been compared to the earlier Academy Award-winning programme The War Game produced in Britain two decades prior and its contemporary counterpart The Day After, a 1983 ABC television film depicting a similar scenario in the United States. It was nominated for seven BAFTA awards in 1985 and won for Best Single Drama, Best Design, Best Film Cameraman and Best Film Editor.
WARNING - Despite being a made-for-TV film from 1984, it's utterly harrowing so if you've never seen it before and decide to do so, please be aware of that.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Threads_(1984_film)
Threads is a 1984 British apocalyptic war drama television film jointly produced by the BBC, Nine Network and Western-World Television Inc. Written by Barry Hines and directed and produced by Mick Jackson,[2][3] it is a dramatic account of nuclear war and its effects in Britain, specifically on the city of Sheffield in Northern England. The plot centres on two families as a confrontation between the United States and the Soviet Union erupts. As the nuclear exchange between NATO and the Warsaw Pact begins, the film depicts the medical, economic, social and environmental consequences of nuclear war.[4]
Shot on a budget of £400,000, the film was the first of its kind to depict a nuclear winter. It has been called "a film which comes closest to representing the full horror of nuclear war and its aftermath, as well as the catastrophic impact that the event would have on human culture."[5] It has been compared to the earlier Academy Award-winning programme The War Game produced in Britain two decades prior and its contemporary counterpart The Day After, a 1983 ABC television film depicting a similar scenario in the United States. It was nominated for seven BAFTA awards in 1985 and won for Best Single Drama, Best Design, Best Film Cameraman and Best Film Editor.
Attachment:
threads.jpg
I remember seeing it in 84. Harrowing indeed. I wouldn't watch it again, I felt thoroughly depressed after watching it.
Yes, indeed.
Threads is the type of film that people should watch once, but bear in mind that it's incredibly disturbing even at the best of times so won't be for everyone.
With what's going on at the moment I wouldn't recommend that *at all*
Threads is the type of film that people should watch once, but bear in mind that it's incredibly disturbing even at the best of times so won't be for everyone.
With what's going on at the moment I wouldn't recommend that *at all*
TBH I'm struggling a bit with the whole 'war in Europe' thing (I'm sure others are too), you think you've got your head around the horror and then Russia bombs a maternity hospital, with predictable consequences, and everything is filmed/photographed, everything is documented. I'm my own worst enemy by doom scrolling on Twitter or seeing if there's any new information on The Guardian's website or whatever. I limit myself to an hour of TV news per day now.
I didn't really 'want' to watch Threads but I thought I probably should, it's certainly an important film, and everything it depicts would hold true today. Then you have Putin pretty much explicitly threatening nuclear escalation if any NATO forces get directly involved in Ukraine, so all we can do is try to arm and support the Ukrainians whilst Putin pounds them into the dirt.
It's just all so indescribably horrible and depressing.
I didn't really 'want' to watch Threads but I thought I probably should, it's certainly an important film, and everything it depicts would hold true today. Then you have Putin pretty much explicitly threatening nuclear escalation if any NATO forces get directly involved in Ukraine, so all we can do is try to arm and support the Ukrainians whilst Putin pounds them into the dirt.
It's just all so indescribably horrible and depressing.
It’s one of those things that I’m so keenly aware of how much it’s affected anyone I know that has watched it that I don’t think it’d be good for me to watch. I have a lot of difficulty letting go of things I’ve seen like, I if I think of that little animation I once watched of a kiwi (?) bird that wanted to experience flight just that one time, which I saw over a decade ago now, I instantly cry). From what I’ve understood Threads would not be good for me.
Mad how in the 80s they used to cheerily show stuff like Threads, When the Wind Blows and fucking Watership Down as entertainment for children but then the panic was about some daft gore in video nasties.
markg wrote:
Mad how in the 80s they used to cheerily show stuff like Threads, When the Wind Blows and fucking Watership Down as entertainment for children but then the panic was about some daft gore in video nasties.
No, I don’t think they were ever meant as entertainment (well, maybe WSD). There were a lot of adults that understood the risks of a nuclear conflict and wanted to make sure that we grew up learning about that.
And no, Mimi, you should not under any circumstances watch Threads. It will haunt you for a very long time.
To bring a bit more positivity into a very bleak topic, I’m getting some small amount of comfort from how well this is going, compared to how it could have been.
Firstly, the Ukrainians have turned out to be some of the most amazing courageous people you could imagine.
Their armed forces have held back one of the planets largest military forces, and as much as we can see, have been giving far better than they got.
Their civilian population has stepped up to volunteer in ways that many wouldn’t.
Western governments have been very quick to provide effective anti-air and anti-tank weapons that are being put to very good use.
The Russian armed forces have done a lot of damage but appear to be struggling and in some cases poorly trained and motivated.
NATO members appear to be taking the right balance between building up defensive forces but not provoking an escalation.
There have been horrific civilian deaths, but many millions have escaped safely.
The international community has come together to impose more and deeper sanctions that Russia expected.
Many international businesses have implemented their own effective sanctions on moral grounds.
Ordinary Russian citizens are protesting in large numbers at great risk.
Crucial third parties like China have not supported Russia as they could so easily have done.
Formerly neutral nations are moving quickly to join the European Union or NATO.
The neighbouring countries receiving refugees are doing a great job of welcoming people, providing immediate care and supplies then helping them move on.
Poland in particular is being awesome with what their volunteers and official teams are achieving.
Firstly, the Ukrainians have turned out to be some of the most amazing courageous people you could imagine.
Their armed forces have held back one of the planets largest military forces, and as much as we can see, have been giving far better than they got.
Their civilian population has stepped up to volunteer in ways that many wouldn’t.
Western governments have been very quick to provide effective anti-air and anti-tank weapons that are being put to very good use.
The Russian armed forces have done a lot of damage but appear to be struggling and in some cases poorly trained and motivated.
NATO members appear to be taking the right balance between building up defensive forces but not provoking an escalation.
There have been horrific civilian deaths, but many millions have escaped safely.
The international community has come together to impose more and deeper sanctions that Russia expected.
Many international businesses have implemented their own effective sanctions on moral grounds.
Ordinary Russian citizens are protesting in large numbers at great risk.
Crucial third parties like China have not supported Russia as they could so easily have done.
Formerly neutral nations are moving quickly to join the European Union or NATO.
The neighbouring countries receiving refugees are doing a great job of welcoming people, providing immediate care and supplies then helping them move on.
Poland in particular is being awesome with what their volunteers and official teams are achieving.
Dr Zoidberg wrote:
And no, Mimi, you should not under any circumstances watch Threads. It will haunt you for a very long time.
I'm glad I watched it, I think, I just felt like I should try to give myself an idea of what the world is staring down the barrels of (Threads is fictionalised but they researched it extensively and took on board a load of top-tier scientific advice in terms of what to depict as being realistic, albeit some of it is best guesses since it goes 13 years into the timeline beyond a full scale nuclear war).
When Threads originally aired in 1984 I was ten years old, I never saw it at the time, and my dad certainly wouldn't have let me watch it (I don't know whether or not he was aware of it and actively shielded us from it).
Watching it at the age of 47 it thoroughly rattled me, even though in many regards it didn't give me any new information (i.e. there are no winners, the aftermath is horrible, society completely breaks down and you're better off dying in the initial blasts than living to see what comes after) - it's just so starkly and unflinchingly portrayed, and the final shot of the film is devastating. I also wasn't expecting it to spend so long in the 'before' phase, showing so much of everyday life for average people doing average things, so that when the destruction comes, the sense of brutal and total loss is palpable.
There's also the way that many of the principle characters just 'disappear', there is no closure, we never find out what happened to them, a deliberate choice of course and it adds to the sense of what has been annihilated.
But no, definitely don't watch it Mimi based on what you've said.
Mimi wrote:
if I think of that little animation I once watched of a kiwi (?) bird that wanted to experience flight just that one time, which I saw over a decade ago now, I instantly cry
Me too. I’m convinced that people who don’t cry at that animation are not human.
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