Be Excellent To Each Other

And, you know, party on. Dude.

All times are UTC [ DST ]




Reply to topic  [ 4059 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1 ... 55, 56, 57, 58, 59, 60, 61 ... 82  Next
Author Message
 Post subject: Re: Middle Age Spread
PostPosted: Mon Jun 25, 2018 10:44 
User avatar
Master of dodgy spelling....

Joined: 25th Sep, 2008
Posts: 22533
Location: shropshire, uk
I was a tad disappointed... over it now.. :)

_________________
MetalAngel wrote:
Kovacs: From 'unresponsive' to 'kebab' in 3.5 seconds


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Middle Age Spread
PostPosted: Mon Jun 25, 2018 11:17 
User avatar
Esoteric

Joined: 12th Dec, 2008
Posts: 11767
Location: On Mars as an anthropologist...
Kris wrote:
I went the other way, I was down to slim-fit shirts; I gained a bunch of weight over a year after getting a girlfriend (wtf is that about) and now have to wear regular ones; I tried one of my shirts on the other day I am at a loss how this shirt EVER fit me at all.

Semi-related however, I threw in a couple of chin-ups when I was doing my pull-ups as I was curious as to whether or not I could do these now. I could do definitely do them but still find the pull-ups MUCH easier!


I was a UK large when I met my ex. 13 stone ish, , maybe 13.5. Then there was a culmination of loads of things. I was put on Quetiapine (massive weight gain) and Pregabalin (massive weight gain ffs) as well as terrible water retention. Before I knew it I was up to over 18st, and in XXL Tshirts (which I swear in England means XXlong ffs). I was eating three times a day (too many, I don't do anything much) and pigging a bit. Sandwich for lunch (with like three bags of crisps) then a large dinner. Then I would go to bed, and eat a bowl of cereal and then sometimes a sandwich and three bags of crisps. Was a bit of a nightmare tbh. The pills I take (Quetiapine) firstly make you feel like you've not eaten for days, then you don't feel full :( so to go on this diet now (just my main meal, all sugar cut) has been very hard. Especially the bedtime bit.

That is why I was a little disappointed that I had "only" lost a stone. Cut 30-45% of my food intake (and all of the crap and 6 sugars a day I was putting in my coffee) and only lose a stone :( thing is, I can feel muscle everywhere now. Especially in my legs and stomach. Still got tits (apparently Quetiapine also causes that ffs) but yeah I feel much better.

_________________
I reject your context and reality, and substitute my own.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Middle Age Spread
PostPosted: Mon Jun 25, 2018 11:21 

Joined: 5th Jun, 2018
Posts: 389
Mate fat man legs are the best (I am guilty of these too) when you lose weight you keep your huge muscular legs.

How long was the 'only a stone' lost in? 'Cause at the end of the day you can't lose all that weight instantly it'd be unhealthy and cause you more problems.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Middle Age Spread
PostPosted: Mon Jun 25, 2018 11:39 
User avatar
Esoteric

Joined: 12th Dec, 2008
Posts: 11767
Location: On Mars as an anthropologist...
Kris wrote:
Mate fat man legs are the best (I am guilty of these too) when you lose weight you keep your huge muscular legs.

How long was the 'only a stone' lost in? 'Cause at the end of the day you can't lose all that weight instantly it'd be unhealthy and cause you more problems.


It's been about two months now. Having said that I didn't weigh myself before I started, so I may well have been heavier than I thought as I hadn't weighed myself in two months but had been stuffing my face.

I've always had those thighs man. I got them from living in London for 27 years and always riding a BMX because cabs were ridiculous and buses and trains packed, unreliable and expensive. Cars were a a joke (£2k third party only in 1997 insurance) so I just rode.

I started out my GT on 42/16. It was stupid. I could step through it in about two cycles. So I increased it to 48/18, then found myself pushing past that too easy so now I run 48/16. Thing is that bike is ultra light and the tyres are 110PSI so there is absolutely bugger all rolling resistance lol.

When I first got the orange PK Ripper it was so light it scared me (19 odd pounds for a big bike like that) but thankfully the mags put some weight onto that. Anything under 30lbs is fine. If a bike is too light I find it unnerving for some reason. I still have the spoke wheels, so if the mags piss me off I can switch them back. It just feels nicer with them on. More grounded. As I learned with my GT race bike the lighter and stiffer you go the more crap your wrists and hands need to take.

_________________
I reject your context and reality, and substitute my own.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Middle Age Spread
PostPosted: Mon Jun 25, 2018 11:45 

Joined: 5th Jun, 2018
Posts: 389
Mate that's not bad; as long as you make the change and stick to it you'll be set.

(I say this and eat basically whatever I like and try to offset that by going to the gym frequently)


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Middle Age Spread
PostPosted: Mon Jun 25, 2018 13:15 
User avatar
ugvm'er at heart...

Joined: 4th Mar, 2010
Posts: 22255
2lbs a week seems to be the target for a sustainable weight loss, so 1st in two months seems right to me, especially as you are exercising at the same time and should be building a bit of muscle.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Middle Age Spread
PostPosted: Mon Jun 25, 2018 13:22 
User avatar
Esoteric

Joined: 12th Dec, 2008
Posts: 11767
Location: On Mars as an anthropologist...
Yeah. It is very visible tbh. This is JC & Co at my uncle's 70th. That's my fat ass on the right hand end. See how I am sticking out my leg, 'cause I was so fat I was getting pins and needles.

Image

I definitely look a bloody good sight slimmer than that ! mind you that was at the worst time. My other uncle had died from cancer shortly before that and there was a lot of sadness about :( So we had a nice family bash to cheer us all up. I almost smiled :D

_________________
I reject your context and reality, and substitute my own.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Middle Age Spread
PostPosted: Mon Jun 25, 2018 13:27 
User avatar
sneering elitist

Joined: 25th May, 2014
Posts: 3991
Location: Broseley
John, you're doing really well. Like Kris & Trooper said, that loss is at a good pace. Too much too soon and it'll bounce straight back on again.

If you're feeling hungry after meals, up your protein intake.

_________________
i make websites


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Middle Age Spread
PostPosted: Mon Jun 25, 2018 13:27 

Joined: 5th Jun, 2018
Posts: 389
Judging by the earlier picture you're looking good mate; keep at it and before long you'll be even slimmer than you were before! :DD


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Middle Age Spread
PostPosted: Tue Jun 26, 2018 9:12 
User avatar
Esoteric

Joined: 12th Dec, 2008
Posts: 11767
Location: On Mars as an anthropologist...
Kris wrote:
Judging by the earlier picture you're looking good mate; keep at it and before long you'll be even slimmer than you were before! :DD


It wouldn't be so bad but my frame simply isn't made to carry that sort of weight. I was tiny as a child (Run Forrest ! run !)

Image

And remained under 14 stone throughout my entire adulthood. This was taken about a month after I moved in with my ex wife.

Image

This was taken in 2001

Image

2010

Image

So yeah, dealing with this sorta weight has been really difficult. I also packed up smoking shortly after the pic with me there smoking (switched to vape, not smoked since) so I know that has taken its toll too. Add in a new girlfriend back then (so stuff your face) and the pills and etc? yeah, was like the perfect storm of weight gaining crap lol.

_________________
I reject your context and reality, and substitute my own.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Middle Age Spread
PostPosted: Tue Jun 26, 2018 9:14 

Joined: 5th Jun, 2018
Posts: 389
Well, a lot of the time, realising there is an issue is the first and hardest step.

Guess we'll see what you look like in a couple of months!


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Middle Age Spread
PostPosted: Wed Jun 27, 2018 14:23 
User avatar
Esoteric

Joined: 12th Dec, 2008
Posts: 11767
Location: On Mars as an anthropologist...
I got a letter from the doc about two months back. It said what I already knew, that I was pre diabetic. They wanted me to go in for a test (6 months after the last) as it was getting quite bad. I decided to hold it off for about 6 weeks to see what I could do about it first.

Had the blood test on the 12th. Then did not hear anything (which with bloods is usually good news). Turns out my suspicions were correct, I am not longer pre diabetic and my BSL are completely normal.

God, that's a weight off. Especially when you are terrified of needles !

_________________
I reject your context and reality, and substitute my own.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Middle Age Spread
PostPosted: Wed Jun 27, 2018 14:42 
User avatar
Master of dodgy spelling....

Joined: 25th Sep, 2008
Posts: 22533
Location: shropshire, uk
That is bloody great news...

_________________
MetalAngel wrote:
Kovacs: From 'unresponsive' to 'kebab' in 3.5 seconds


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Middle Age Spread
PostPosted: Wed Jun 27, 2018 14:59 
User avatar
Esoteric

Joined: 12th Dec, 2008
Posts: 11767
Location: On Mars as an anthropologist...
Yeah for sure. Like, lottery winning news.

I'm so stoked. Sometimes when my legs hurt from riding and my bum is sore I think "Ugh, why am I doing this?" and then I get days like today.

I would have died. It would have killed me, no doubt. There is no way I would have ever stuck a needle in myself knowingly (when I get blood taken I have to look away, get my arms held down so I don't jump, and then be told exactly when it is going in). So it would have killed me.

I was fine with needles until I was 7. Then I got ran over, and they came and stuck me three times a day for about 5 weeks. That was where my phobia began. Now? god if I saw it going in I would faint.

_________________
I reject your context and reality, and substitute my own.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Middle Age Spread
PostPosted: Wed Jun 27, 2018 15:21 
User avatar
Master of dodgy spelling....

Joined: 25th Sep, 2008
Posts: 22533
Location: shropshire, uk
I said that, trust me you get used to the needles pretty fast. I can now watch them draw blood.

_________________
MetalAngel wrote:
Kovacs: From 'unresponsive' to 'kebab' in 3.5 seconds


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Middle Age Spread
PostPosted: Mon Jul 02, 2018 12:29 
User avatar
sneering elitist

Joined: 25th May, 2014
Posts: 3991
Location: Broseley
Took a shameless "suns out guns out" selfie for instagram on Saturday and on a whim put it side by side with a shot from the end of April to compare arm/shoulder growth (which I've been putting more effort into this year) and was pleasantly surprised:

Image

Not just arm/shoulder gains but you can see the weight loss around my middle so that's nice.

Aiming for 140lbs now in the hope it'll bring out more definition, whilst also working constantly towards those pull-ups >:(

Also need more sleep because I look knackered :DD

_________________
i make websites


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Middle Age Spread
PostPosted: Mon Jul 02, 2018 12:35 
User avatar
Master of dodgy spelling....

Joined: 25th Sep, 2008
Posts: 22533
Location: shropshire, uk
fantastic :)

_________________
MetalAngel wrote:
Kovacs: From 'unresponsive' to 'kebab' in 3.5 seconds


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Middle Age Spread
PostPosted: Mon Jul 02, 2018 12:37 
User avatar
Unpossible!

Joined: 27th Jun, 2008
Posts: 38439
No stepladder?


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Middle Age Spread
PostPosted: Mon Jul 02, 2018 12:47 
User avatar
sneering elitist

Joined: 25th May, 2014
Posts: 3991
Location: Broseley
It's in the downstairs loo now, and that's where the cat trays are. Nobody wants to see cat shit in their feed.

_________________
i make websites


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Middle Age Spread
PostPosted: Mon Jul 02, 2018 12:56 
User avatar
Unpossible!

Joined: 27th Jun, 2008
Posts: 38439
Jem wrote:
It's in the downstairs loo now, and that's where the cat trays are. Nobody wants to see cat shit in their feed.

Much appreciated. Cracking guns, btw!


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Middle Age Spread
PostPosted: Mon Jul 02, 2018 13:01 
User avatar
sneering elitist

Joined: 25th May, 2014
Posts: 3991
Location: Broseley
Cheers :D

_________________
i make websites


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Middle Age Spread
PostPosted: Mon Jul 02, 2018 13:51 
User avatar
Comfortably Dumb

Joined: 30th Mar, 2008
Posts: 12034
Location: Sunny Stoke
I always seem to just end up with 'before' photos (of me, not Jem). One day I might reach the 'after' photo stage.

_________________
Consolemad | Under Logic
Curse, the day is long
Realise you don't belong


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Middle Age Spread
PostPosted: Mon Jul 02, 2018 14:16 
User avatar
sneering elitist

Joined: 25th May, 2014
Posts: 3991
Location: Broseley
No such thing as an 'after' photo, just constant ongoing progress ;)

_________________
i make websites


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Middle Age Spread
PostPosted: Wed Jul 04, 2018 21:39 
User avatar

Joined: 30th Mar, 2008
Posts: 16552
Just committed to a half marathon in August. It will be the first running race I've done since school. It's also about twice as far as I've ever run. Quite excited!


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Middle Age Spread
PostPosted: Wed Jul 04, 2018 21:41 
SupaMod
User avatar
Est. 1978

Joined: 27th Mar, 2008
Posts: 69502
Location: Your Mum
Um... Get training, I guess?

_________________
Grim... wrote:
I wish Craster had left some girls for the rest of us.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Middle Age Spread
PostPosted: Wed Jul 04, 2018 22:27 
User avatar

Joined: 30th Mar, 2008
Posts: 16552
Was going to look into performance enhancing drugs instead tbh.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Middle Age Spread
PostPosted: Wed Jul 04, 2018 22:57 
User avatar
Unpossible!

Joined: 27th Jun, 2008
Posts: 38439
markg wrote:
Was going to look into performance enhancing drugs instead tbh.

I can hook you up with fashionable performance enhancer salbutamol for a reasonable price


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Middle Age Spread
PostPosted: Thu Jul 05, 2018 9:12 

Joined: 5th Jun, 2018
Posts: 389
In't that what they put in inhalers?

OH I GET IT NOW THE CYCLISTS.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Middle Age Spread
PostPosted: Thu Jul 05, 2018 9:33 
User avatar
Esoteric

Joined: 12th Dec, 2008
Posts: 11767
Location: On Mars as an anthropologist...
Looking great Jem :)

_________________
I reject your context and reality, and substitute my own.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Middle Age Spread
PostPosted: Thu Jul 05, 2018 9:42 
User avatar
sneering elitist

Joined: 25th May, 2014
Posts: 3991
Location: Broseley
JohnCoffey wrote:
Looking great Jem :)


Thanks dude :)

_________________
i make websites


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Middle Age Spread
PostPosted: Thu Jul 05, 2018 9:55 
User avatar
Esoteric

Joined: 12th Dec, 2008
Posts: 11767
Location: On Mars as an anthropologist...
I will have to start doing that sort of stuff once I am done losing weight. I noticed the other day that my moobs have changed shape. They are more triangular, and half empty :o If I pick them up and let them go it don't half bloody hurt. So yeah, I am going to need to tone up my chest in order to beat the saggy skin. Not that I won't have any, because I know it's par for the course when you lose a few stone.

Talking of which I did lose another 4lb, but this week I am doing nowt (staying with family spending time with family). I am still behaving though, all apart from a piece of birthday cake from my cousin's 18th which I missed. First sweet thing I had eaten in weeks. It was terribly, terribly sweet. I cut sugar about three weeks ago now and I don't miss it at all. Am using that spoonful stuff now.

_________________
I reject your context and reality, and substitute my own.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Middle Age Spread
PostPosted: Fri Jul 06, 2018 13:21 
User avatar
sneering elitist

Joined: 25th May, 2014
Posts: 3991
Location: Broseley
I sympathise, my boobs have also changed shape. They're shrivelling up, gradually being replaced by muscley man-pecs.

:DD

_________________
i make websites


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Middle Age Spread
PostPosted: Fri Jul 06, 2018 13:24 

Joined: 5th Jun, 2018
Posts: 389
Mine too.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Middle Age Spread
PostPosted: Fri Jul 27, 2018 6:43 
User avatar
UltraMod

Joined: 27th Mar, 2008
Posts: 55715
Location: California
Hit my 2st goal today. I haven't weighed this little in four years.

_________________
I am currently under construction.
Thank you for your patience.


Image


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Middle Age Spread
PostPosted: Fri Jul 27, 2018 7:20 
User avatar
Excellent Painter

Joined: 30th Apr, 2008
Posts: 7315
Location: Behind you
You weigh 2st!

_________________
twitter || website
Malibu Stacy. Everybody's favourite back seat driver


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Middle Age Spread
PostPosted: Fri Jul 27, 2018 7:45 
User avatar
UltraMod

Joined: 27th Mar, 2008
Posts: 55715
Location: California
DBSnappa wrote:
You weigh 2st!

One of my legs probably does.

I meant weight *loss* obviously.

_________________
I am currently under construction.
Thank you for your patience.


Image


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Middle Age Spread
PostPosted: Fri Jul 27, 2018 8:01 
SupaMod
User avatar
Est. 1978

Joined: 27th Mar, 2008
Posts: 69502
Location: Your Mum
Lonewolves wrote:
DBSnappa wrote:
You weigh 2st!

One of my legs probably does.

Hmm. Well now I'm wondering how much an average leg weighs.

_________________
Grim... wrote:
I wish Craster had left some girls for the rest of us.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Middle Age Spread
PostPosted: Fri Jul 27, 2018 8:19 
User avatar
ugvm'er at heart...

Joined: 4th Mar, 2010
Posts: 22255
Grim... wrote:
Lonewolves wrote:
DBSnappa wrote:
You weigh 2st!

One of my legs probably does.

Hmm. Well now I'm wondering how much an average leg weighs.


Me too! 2st seems light for a leg.

Edit: https://www.quora.com/If-a-person-weigh ... -arm-weigh

Huh, seems 2st is pretty much exactly right!


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Middle Age Spread
PostPosted: Fri Jul 27, 2018 8:35 
User avatar
Master of dodgy spelling....

Joined: 25th Sep, 2008
Posts: 22533
Location: shropshire, uk
Well done fella

_________________
MetalAngel wrote:
Kovacs: From 'unresponsive' to 'kebab' in 3.5 seconds


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Middle Age Spread
PostPosted: Fri Jul 27, 2018 8:36 
SupaMod
User avatar
Est. 1978

Joined: 27th Mar, 2008
Posts: 69502
Location: Your Mum
Kov is more impressed than I am that you can guess the weight of a leg.

_________________
Grim... wrote:
I wish Craster had left some girls for the rest of us.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Middle Age Spread
PostPosted: Fri Jul 27, 2018 8:46 
User avatar
Master of dodgy spelling....

Joined: 25th Sep, 2008
Posts: 22533
Location: shropshire, uk
Yes I am... not sure how heavy mine is

_________________
MetalAngel wrote:
Kovacs: From 'unresponsive' to 'kebab' in 3.5 seconds


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Middle Age Spread
PostPosted: Fri Jul 27, 2018 11:13 
User avatar
UltraMod

Joined: 27th Mar, 2008
Posts: 55715
Location: California
Onto the next goal! I've set myself another half stone target. If I achieve that it'll be my lowest weight since 2013.

_________________
I am currently under construction.
Thank you for your patience.


Image


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Middle Age Spread
PostPosted: Fri Jul 27, 2018 11:28 
User avatar
Master of dodgy spelling....

Joined: 25th Sep, 2008
Posts: 22533
Location: shropshire, uk
My goals are, finish my tri, then get fat :P

_________________
MetalAngel wrote:
Kovacs: From 'unresponsive' to 'kebab' in 3.5 seconds


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Middle Age Spread
PostPosted: Fri Jul 27, 2018 12:54 
User avatar
sneering elitist

Joined: 25th May, 2014
Posts: 3991
Location: Broseley
KovacsC wrote:
My goals are, finish my tri, then get fat :P

Why? :DD

_________________
i make websites


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Middle Age Spread
PostPosted: Fri Jul 27, 2018 13:01 
User avatar
Master of dodgy spelling....

Joined: 25th Sep, 2008
Posts: 22533
Location: shropshire, uk
because i have trained for the tri.... might as well do it... :P

_________________
MetalAngel wrote:
Kovacs: From 'unresponsive' to 'kebab' in 3.5 seconds


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Middle Age Spread
PostPosted: Fri Jul 27, 2018 13:22 
User avatar
sneering elitist

Joined: 25th May, 2014
Posts: 3991
Location: Broseley
Surely that means you've just got to lose it again for your next one?

_________________
i make websites


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Middle Age Spread
PostPosted: Fri Jul 27, 2018 17:42 
User avatar
Master of dodgy spelling....

Joined: 25th Sep, 2008
Posts: 22533
Location: shropshire, uk
Good point.. i could retire :P

_________________
MetalAngel wrote:
Kovacs: From 'unresponsive' to 'kebab' in 3.5 seconds


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Middle Age Spread
PostPosted: Mon Jul 30, 2018 12:44 
User avatar
Master of dodgy spelling....

Joined: 25th Sep, 2008
Posts: 22533
Location: shropshire, uk
Motivational tattoo done. I will finish my race next year.


You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.

_________________
MetalAngel wrote:
Kovacs: From 'unresponsive' to 'kebab' in 3.5 seconds


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Middle Age Spread
PostPosted: Sat Aug 11, 2018 12:55 
User avatar
Isn't that lovely?

Joined: 30th Mar, 2008
Posts: 10910
Location: Devon
Attachment:
Screenshot_20180811-125312.png


Busy week on holiday.


You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.

_________________
Where's the Kaboom? I was expecting an Earth shattering Kaboom!


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Middle Age Spread
PostPosted: Sat Aug 11, 2018 16:34 
User avatar
Esoteric

Joined: 12th Dec, 2008
Posts: 11767
Location: On Mars as an anthropologist...
I've probably put some back on in my slump of depression over the last month. However, now until November is prime riding time for me (so you can warm up and get warm enough without dying of heat) so I will be riding lots.

The holiday I booked for October (nothing fancy just a few days in Hampshire) is partly done around taking a bike with me. Which will be ace, as it's a beautiful part of the world.

_________________
I reject your context and reality, and substitute my own.


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Reply to topic  [ 4059 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1 ... 55, 56, 57, 58, 59, 60, 61 ... 82  Next

All times are UTC [ DST ]


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Kern and 0 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search within this thread:
You are using the 'Ted' forum. Bill doesn't really exist any more. Bogus!
Want to help out with the hosting / advertising costs? That's very nice of you.
Are you on a mobile phone? Try http://beex.co.uk/m/
RIP, Owen. RIP, MrC.

Powered by a very Grim... version of phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group.