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Its my Birthday soon...and
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Author:  LaceSensor [ Mon Jul 28, 2008 13:57 ]
Post subject:  Its my Birthday soon...and
PErsonally I know nothing of consumer level audio.
Conversely I know a bit about sound engineering, live bands, guitar amps.

Anyway, its my birthday soon, so any cash I get, I am going to amalgamate with some spare dollars I have and invest in a 5.1 amp and speakers.

Now, I wont have gobfulls of cash, but I would like something that sounds nice and is easy to use, perhaps using the 5.1 capabilities of the x360.

How does something like this work for TV? Do you just "connect them together"?

And the major point here - can anyone tell me what they own / recommend, and approximate price. I would ideally like to spend less than £200 I suppose, as there are other things I want in the £200-400 bracket.

Thanks!
Author:  ElephantBanjoGnome [ Mon Jul 28, 2008 13:58 ]
Post subject:  Re: Its my Birthday soon...and
oh yeah, august innit, I'd better get you a card.

Basic sound systems etc. are available from currys from £25-50, I was looking at some basic cd players/speaker combos and the like the other day.
Author:  Zardoz [ Mon Jul 28, 2008 14:00 ]
Post subject:  Re: Its my Birthday soon...and
I have a Sony AV 5.1 receiver that EVERYTHING get chucked into 360, Wii DVD player, Sky box and Ipod.

Cost me £115(ish) from Richer Sounds then I spent £150(ish) on a set of surround sound speakers and sub.
Author:  Zardoz [ Mon Jul 28, 2008 14:03 ]
Post subject:  Re: Its my Birthday soon...and
Perhaps this:http://www.richersounds.com/showproduct.php?cda=showproduct&pid=SONY-STRDG710-SIL

and these:http://www.richersounds.com/showproduct.php?cda=showproduct&pid=YAMA-NSP110-BLK

would sort you right out.
Author:  LaceSensor [ Mon Jul 28, 2008 14:03 ]
Post subject:  Re: Its my Birthday soon...and
Ah right cool :) nice one Zardoz i check Richer Sounds out.

Normally I dont really care about TV / Film / Game noise, because most people I know dont venture into home cinema. However I went to my bro's house and he has a decent set up and it got me interested.

August, rgr.
Author:  Doctor Glyndwr [ Mon Jul 28, 2008 14:05 ]
Post subject:  Re: Its my Birthday soon...and
I own a Yamaha RXV-361 which I bought for £160 but is now £120 on that link. It is plugged into an Eltax 5.1 speaker set I bought for £150 in 2004, which sounds reasonably good to my ears.

Image
My rig (click for biggies and a list of the equipment).

Richer Sounds seem to have a number of 5.1 speaker sets in the £100-200 range, although notable they all have weedy little front speakers. I like my floor standers.
Author:  Joans [ Mon Jul 28, 2008 14:06 ]
Post subject:  Re: Its my Birthday soon...and
First thing you need to do, is look at everything you're going to want to hook up to it and see how many inputs you need and what type.

Going back to your other thread, you use HDMI to hook up your 360, so I think you need to buy an overpriced adaptor from microsoft to get an optical output (you can hack your component cable apart if you'd prefer). Alternatively, you could get a receiver with HDMI inputs, but that would probably ramp the price up. If your tv has an optical out socket, it may or may not pass the full 5.1 to your receiver.
Repeat this for every other piece of equipment that you might want to hook up. Enjoy.
Author:  Zardoz [ Mon Jul 28, 2008 14:06 ]
Post subject:  Re: Its my Birthday soon...and
One thing I made sure of is that the AV receiver had an optical input for the 360, they probably all do now.
Author:  LaceSensor [ Mon Jul 28, 2008 14:06 ]
Post subject:  Re: Its my Birthday soon...and
You can get the same ones in Silver for £79. bargain!
Author:  Zardoz [ Mon Jul 28, 2008 14:07 ]
Post subject:  Re: Its my Birthday soon...and
Mr Gaywood, why is your 360 pulling his tongue out?
Author:  Doctor Glyndwr [ Mon Jul 28, 2008 14:08 ]
Post subject:  Re: Its my Birthday soon...and
Joans is right, exactly what are you planning on plugging into this, Lacey, and over what inputs.
Author:  Joans [ Mon Jul 28, 2008 14:12 ]
Post subject:  Re: Its my Birthday soon...and
richardgaywood wrote:
I own a Yamaha RXV-361 which I bought for £160 but is now £120 on that link. It is plugged into an Eltax 5.1 speaker set I bought for £150 in 2004, which sounds reasonably good to my ears.


Minor thread hijack here, sorry. Rich, I've got the RXV-359 and I tend to have issues watching dvds where I can't get the volume levels right. If I have it loud enough to hear people when they're talking quietly then I have to turn it down whenever anything really loud happens. It takes a bit away from my films when I have to be poised to turn the volume up and down all the way through. I seem to have found the right combination of settings so it's ok now, but I was wondering if you (or anyone) had similar issues. I have a complete mish-mash of speakers, so I was wondering if the lack of matching front and centre might be causing it.
Author:  ElephantBanjoGnome [ Mon Jul 28, 2008 14:14 ]
Post subject:  Re: Its my Birthday soon...and
My TV has volume controls, and if I'm watching something via the laptop I plug in a cheap pair of £10 speakers. Do I win?
Author:  Doctor Glyndwr [ Mon Jul 28, 2008 14:15 ]
Post subject:  Re: Its my Birthday soon...and
Joans wrote:
Minor thread hijack here, sorry. Rich, I've got the RXV-359 and I tend to have issues watching dvds where I can't get the volume levels right. If I have it loud enough to hear people when they're talking quietly then I have to turn it down whenever anything really loud happens. It takes a bit away from my films when I have to be poised to turn the volume up and down all the way through. I seem to have found the right combination of settings so it's ok now, but I was wondering if you (or anyone) had similar issues. I have a complete mish-mash of speakers, so I was wondering if the lack of matching front and centre might be causing it.
Sounds like the level is out for your centre speaker -- there is an adjuster for that on my amp, and I would certainly think so on yours too. I can't remember where it is off hand though I'm afraid. It's certainly there though, as is a setting to fiddle the tone to the middle speaker so it matches the front left and front right (that's quite a fun piece of adjustment, it makes pans through the front three speakers sound harmonious).

Also, Night mode i.e. dynamic range compression is your friend, particularly if you like your neighbours.

Aside to the aside: 5.1 amps of even middling complexity need setup GUIs that use the TV screen and not just the piddly screen on the front.
Author:  LaceSensor [ Mon Jul 28, 2008 14:16 ]
Post subject:  Re: Its my Birthday soon...and
richardgaywood wrote:
Joans is right, exactly what are you planning on plugging into this, Lacey, and over what inputs.



360 via HDMI
Wii via component
PS2 via scart
Snes via ariel type cable (coax?)

with a 32'' HDTV
Author:  Doctor Glyndwr [ Mon Jul 28, 2008 14:16 ]
Post subject:  Re: Its my Birthday soon...and
ComicalGnomes wrote:
My TV has volume controls, and if I'm watching something via the laptop I plug in a cheap pair of £10 speakers. Do I win?
Often, when a tradesman leaves rubbish in my garden, I calmly clear up and totally resist the urge to kick a tramp to death. Do I win?
Author:  LaceSensor [ Mon Jul 28, 2008 14:18 ]
Post subject:  Re: Its my Birthday soon...and
Also - am I correct in thinking I can connect my Ipod to this Amp thing, and have a nice stereo in my "lounge area" too ? without the TV being on?
Author:  ElephantBanjoGnome [ Mon Jul 28, 2008 14:19 ]
Post subject:  Re: Its my Birthday soon...and
richardgaywood wrote:
Do I win?

No, no you do not.

Besides, I'd never take out anger on an innocent when it was meant for someone else. I store it all up in a probably non-catalysmic way, for later use.
Author:  Joans [ Mon Jul 28, 2008 14:23 ]
Post subject:  Re: Its my Birthday soon...and
LaceSensor wrote:
richardgaywood wrote:
Joans is right, exactly what are you planning on plugging into this, Lacey, and over what inputs.



360 via HDMI
Wii via component
PS2 via scart
Snes via ariel type cable (coax?)

with a 32'' HDTV


For budget reasons (as well as others), I'd just use this for your audio. Assuming you can plug everything you want to into your tv at the same time.

These will be fun:
360 - You'll need to get/make an optical output for your 360
Wii - You can get some phono splitter (or extender) cables from maplins to plug the audio plugs into your amp.
PS2 - Optical output (although it's disabled for Parappa the Rapper 2, if you happen to play that). You used to be able to get scart cables with a little box with phono sockets on, I guess you still can from somewhere.
Snes - No idea, you can get a composite cable for it can't you, so you could hook up the audio from that.

With some of those, you'll need to worry about whether you also want the audio to go to the tv as well.
Author:  Doctor Glyndwr [ Mon Jul 28, 2008 14:23 ]
Post subject:  Re: Its my Birthday soon...and
LaceSensor wrote:
360 via HDMI
As mentioned, you either need to get an amp with HDMI (will be really stretching your budget, but on the plus side, is more future proof) or get that adapory thing MS sell, or hack one.

Option 1 means you will plug the Xbox into the amp over HDMI and the amp into the TV over HDMI. The amp will strip the audio signal out of the HDMI wire (to go to the speakers) and pass the video on to the TV.

Options 2 and 3 mean you will be plugging the 360 into the TV over HDMI and into the amp over a SPDIF optical connection.

Both of these options sound pretty much the same. You will probably need to turn the volume on the telly down.

Quote:
Wii via component
Pretty much any amp you buy will have component ports on it. This means you will be plugging the Wii into the amp and then the amp into the TV's component ports. As with the HDMI description, the amp will pass through the video and take the audio for itself.

Quote:
PS2 via scart
SCART is a cock as amps don't have it. Might be an idea to get a component cable for the PS2 and use that instead; alternatively, leave the SCART connection as it is and add an optical connection from the PS2 to the amp. You'd need to turn the TV volume down.

Quote:
Snes via ariel type cable (coax?)
It'll be piss awkward to make this work unless the TV has some audio out jacks on it. Best leave this plugged into the TV alone unless you have a burning desire to play loud beeps.

And yes you can plug your iPod into the amp.
Author:  kalmar [ Mon Jul 28, 2008 14:24 ]
Post subject:  Re: Its my Birthday soon...and
LaceSensor wrote:
Also - am I correct in thinking I can connect my Ipod to this Amp thing, and have a nice stereo in my "lounge area" too ? without the TV being on?


I have a long bit of twin shielded microphone wire going to my amp (an ancient Panasonic mini hifi) from the coffee table - then I can plug my ipod in there and have teh tunez.

However I've also tried the far more heath-robinson approach of connecting the headphone output of my iMac to an FM transmitter, then tuning the hifi into that (or any other radio in the house), and using the Remote app on the iphone to control iTunes.
Author:  Doctor Glyndwr [ Mon Jul 28, 2008 14:26 ]
Post subject:  Re: Its my Birthday soon...and
If you can stretch the budget another £40ish a Logitech Harmony all-in-one remote is useful, particularly if you have non-geeks using your TV rig. It'll do things like offer you a "play Xbox" button which will turn the amp and Xbox and TV on all at once, and turn the amp to the Xbox channel, and the TV to the Xbox channel. Otherwise you have to change channels on loads of different devices to be the same which gets old fast.
Author:  Joans [ Mon Jul 28, 2008 14:29 ]
Post subject:  Re: Its my Birthday soon...and
richardgaywood wrote:
Sounds like the level is out for your centre speaker -- there is an adjuster for that on my amp, and I would certainly think so on yours too. I can't remember where it is off hand though I'm afraid. It's certainly there though, as is a setting to fiddle the tone to the middle speaker so it matches the front left and front right (that's quite a fun piece of adjustment, it makes pans through the front three speakers sound harmonious).

Also, Night mode i.e. dynamic range compression is your friend, particularly if you like your neighbours.

Aside to the aside: 5.1 amps of even middling complexity need setup GUIs that use the TV screen and not just the piddly screen on the front.


Seriously, I've fiddled with the levels for ages. I ended up with a centre speaker that was ridiculously loud and two really quiet front speakers (so if I listened to anything that wasn't 5.1 it sounded like it was all coming through the centre speaker as the others were so quiet in comparison).
Anyway, I think I've got it now (and I'm too scared to mess about with it), I just wondered if was supposed to be such a precise art.
Author:  Doctor Glyndwr [ Mon Jul 28, 2008 14:31 ]
Post subject:  Re: Its my Birthday soon...and
ComicalGnomes wrote:
Besides, I'd never take out anger on an innocent when it was meant for someone else. I store it all up in a probably non-catalysmic way, for later use.
Have you ever seen the Simpsons episode, I Am Furious Yellow? I'm just askin'.

Joans wrote:
I just wondered if was supposed to be such a precise art.
No, I've set a few 5.1 systems up, for mates and suchlike, and it's never been that fiddly. It usually needs tweaking but it's not normally that problematic. You may have been unlucky with whatever random mix of speakers you have.
Author:  kalmar [ Mon Jul 28, 2008 14:33 ]
Post subject:  Re: Its my Birthday soon...and
richardgaywood wrote:
Have you ever seen the Simpsons episode, I Am Furious Yellow? I'm just askin'.

Is that a The Fall reference?
Author:  ElephantBanjoGnome [ Mon Jul 28, 2008 14:34 ]
Post subject:  Re: Its my Birthday soon...and
richardgaywood wrote:
Have you ever seen the Simpsons episode, I Am Furious Yellow? I'm just askin'.

No, I think I've seen the first 7 or 8 series of the simpsons but I never catch any 'new' ones. The times I do manage to catch a simpsons ep it's one I've seen 438 times before.
Author:  Doctor Glyndwr [ Mon Jul 28, 2008 14:36 ]
Post subject:  Re: Its my Birthday soon...and
ComicalGnomes wrote:
No, I think I've seen the first 7 or 8 series of the simpsons but I never catch any 'new' ones. The times I do manage to catch a simpsons ep it's one I've seen 438 times before.
You should make an effort to see this one. Not only is a rare genuinely funny later Simpsons episode, but it revolves around Homer become furiously angry.
Author:  LaceSensor [ Mon Jul 28, 2008 14:37 ]
Post subject:  Re: Its my Birthday soon...and
Interesting. Looks like have some reasearch to do.

This logitech magic wand you speak of sounds fantastic.

I can push budgets to be honest, as when I wrote this thread I had NO idea what things cost. The only other 5.1 thing I have is some creative £40 speakers for my PC.
Author:  Doctor Glyndwr [ Mon Jul 28, 2008 14:39 ]
Post subject:  Re: Its my Birthday soon...and
LaceSensor wrote:
This logitech magic wand you speak of sounds fantastic.
Best gadget I've ever bought, and I own an iPhone.
Author:  ElephantBanjoGnome [ Mon Jul 28, 2008 14:41 ]
Post subject:  Re: Its my Birthday soon...and
richardgaywood wrote:
Not only is a rare genuinely funny later Simpsons episode, but it revolves around Homer become furiously angry.

Ah yes, I have seen that one, very funny. I don't have lumps on my head, but I've got an awesome vein on my temple that pops right out when my brain is supplied with rage.
Author:  Grim... [ Mon Jul 28, 2008 14:46 ]
Post subject:  Re: Its my Birthday soon...and
I second the Logitech magic wand.
I've got a Logitech Surround Sound system with wireless rear speakers (although you still have to plug them into a power socket) which is hyper-ace. I bought it with my Little Savages donations (er, after I'd paid for the server, obviously, Savages players) for about £220, but it's probably a lot less than that now.
Aha - about £180 (http://www.electrormart.com/shop/logitech--z5400-51-thx310w-rms-p-4778.html), although it looks like there's a newer version out.
Author:  LaceSensor [ Mon Jul 28, 2008 14:49 ]
Post subject:  Re: Its my Birthday soon...and
Does that need a seperate amp, Grim... ?

I like wireless stuffs :)
Author:  Grim... [ Mon Jul 28, 2008 14:50 ]
Post subject:  Re: Its my Birthday soon...and
No, the amp is on the back of the Sub - that's everything you need. It's got two optical inputs and one component input. It's a very very good system.
Author:  AceAceBaby [ Mon Jul 28, 2008 15:49 ]
Post subject:  Re: Its my Birthday soon...and
Onkyo are popular, but twice the price in the UK than the US, more than I could stomach.

I have one of these
http://www.richersounds.com/showproduct ... B-640R-BLK

Though I don't get to use it at the moment. It's very nice, though, going into a set of Mordaunt Short speakers.
Author:  Doctor Glyndwr [ Mon Jul 28, 2008 15:50 ]
Post subject:  Re: Its my Birthday soon...and
Onkyo would have my recommendation if the budget were bigger, yes.

Edit: that's a hell of a lot of connections, AceAceBaby, but then you know that. Two ethernet?!?
Edit2: oh, it's for some sort of multiroom setup, fair enough.
Author:  AceAceBaby [ Mon Jul 28, 2008 15:53 ]
Post subject:  Re: Its my Birthday soon...and
I don't think they're ethernet. It has something for a service control to plug in, and something for some multi room something or other.

I wish I had it at my house, I've run out of things to plug into. It weighs a ton though, and the wiring, oh jebus, the wiring.
Author:  Doctor Glyndwr [ Mon Jul 28, 2008 15:55 ]
Post subject:  Re: Its my Birthday soon...and
AceAceBaby wrote:
I don't think they're ethernet. It has something for a service control to plug in, and something for some multi room something or other.
Yeah, I made an edit2 above after looking at a high res pic of the backside (fnarr, etc).

AceAceBaby wrote:
I wish I had it at my house, I've run out of things to plug into. It weighs a ton though, and the wiring, oh jebus, the wiring.
I can imagine. I also see "maximum power consumption 1400W" which is humbling.
Author:  tossrStu [ Mon Jul 28, 2008 20:28 ]
Post subject:  Re: Its my Birthday soon...and
This Sony 5.1/amp setup is supposed to be pretty good:

http://www.superfi.co.uk/index.cfm/page ... ct_ID/4144

There's a new version out (HT-SF1300) but apparently very little has changed (just a few extra EQ presets or something) -- nothing that seems to be worth the extra £70 over this set anyway.

I haven't got one myself but I'm thinking of getting a 5.1 setup soon and this is currently top of the list.
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