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 Post subject: Re: Alcoholic Liver Cirrhosis
PostPosted: Sun Aug 16, 2020 7:33 
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Numbskull

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miki wrote:
I'm very glad you're feeling a bit better again - sending you lots of love xx


Thanks Miki, much appreciated x


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 Post subject: Re: Alcoholic Liver Cirrhosis
PostPosted: Sun Aug 16, 2020 7:48 
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Numbskull

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Grim... wrote:
It's not boring, and if it helps you (or helps anyone else) then it's a positive thing. Feel free to "bore us" all you like :)


So glad you chipped in, and yes, it does help big time.

What I meant with boring was that I tend to repeat myself somewhat, because I feel the need to stress the fact that it's the little things that can really make a difference. Just a quick example - we've been having some real scorchers in Freiburg this last week (I hear it's similar in the UK). We live in a top floor flat and it's almost impossible to cool it down at times like this, no matter how many windows you open overnight. So, desperate for cool air, I went out for an early morning bike ride (e-bike, just to be safe, not as fit as I used to be).

It was paradise, clear blue skies, cool air, the occasional cat going about its mysterious business. I felt so alive, how did I not see all this earlier? But better late than never.

And thanks Grim...


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 Post subject: Re: Alcoholic Liver Cirrhosis
PostPosted: Sun Aug 16, 2020 7:53 
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Mr Chonks wrote:
There are a lot of dull posts on here but it doesn’t stop anyone else. Don’t worry about it. ;)


I know, I could name names but I'm far too polite to do it. Yours are mostly good, though.


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 Post subject: Re: Alcoholic Liver Cirrhosis
PostPosted: Wed Aug 19, 2020 18:45 
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You're making me think in a way that is helping with self -analysis and -interrogation, making it easier to say to myself "you know what, you're only considering popping down to the shop because that's what you do, not because you want to, because the relief ever arrives, or you even really enjoy it."

I'm not really pushing for tee-total at this stage but 4 days dry last week (Sunday, Monday, Wednesday, Friday) and this is the 3rd this week (Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday).

No withdrawal, but no feeling good about it. Stupid depression.

What I need is for the scales to twitch, and my t-shirts to snag my belly less - I've probably consumed 10,000 calories less over the last 10 days and it still says 118.8kg. I think I've subconsciously got a lot (very probably too much) riding on seeing the effects of training on *me*, not just the numbers.

Again, thanks. Hopefully your openness having some of the positive impact you hoped it would brings you... Something.


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 Post subject: Re: Alcoholic Liver Cirrhosis
PostPosted: Wed Aug 19, 2020 18:51 
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I’m three days off 9 months sober, and if it weren’t for the crippling depression and anxiety triggered by covid and arseholes at work I would probably be feeling amazing!

However, if I were still drinking I expect I’d feel even worse than I do now.

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 Post subject: Re: Alcoholic Liver Cirrhosis
PostPosted: Wed Aug 19, 2020 19:28 
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BikNorton wrote:
What I need is for the scales to twitch, and my t-shirts to snag my belly less - I've probably consumed 10,000 calories less over the last 10 days and it still says 118.8kg. I think I've subconsciously got a lot (very probably too much) riding on seeing the effects of training on *me*, not just the numbers.

When I stopped drinking it took a few weeks before I saw any weight loss, but lost 10lbs or so with no other changes, if that offers you some reassurance.

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 Post subject: Re: Alcoholic Liver Cirrhosis
PostPosted: Wed Aug 19, 2020 19:31 
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I lost 37lbs at one point, but I’ve put 10 back on since March. Cutting out booze definitely helped.

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 Post subject: Re: Alcoholic Liver Cirrhosis
PostPosted: Wed Aug 19, 2020 20:22 
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Numbskull

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Mr Chonks wrote:
I’m three days off 9 months sober, and if it weren’t for the crippling depression and anxiety triggered by covid and arseholes at work I would probably be feeling amazing!

However, if I were still drinking I expect I’d feel even worse than I do now.


Hey Myp, of course I don't really know you and haven't met you, but that sounds really positive. I'm genuinely very happy to hear that.

The other thing you mentioned about weight loss (although stones and pounds mean bugger all to me these days) - I lost 20-ish kilos after my diagnosis. I'd rather have achieved that a different way, but y'know swings and roundabouts.


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 Post subject: Re: Alcoholic Liver Cirrhosis
PostPosted: Wed Aug 19, 2020 20:28 
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MrC wrote:
Mr Chonks wrote:
I’m three days off 9 months sober, and if it weren’t for the crippling depression and anxiety triggered by covid and arseholes at work I would probably be feeling amazing!

However, if I were still drinking I expect I’d feel even worse than I do now.


Hey Myp, of course I don't really know you and haven't met you, but that sounds really positive. I'm genuinely very happy to hear that.

The other thing you mentioned about weight loss (although stones and pounds mean bugger all to me these days) - I lost 20-ish kilos after my diagnosis. I'd rather have achieved that a different way, but y'know swings and roundabouts.

37lbs is about 17 kilos.

Has the weight loss been because of a change of lifestyle or due to the illness? Before I congratulate you…

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 Post subject: Re: Alcoholic Liver Cirrhosis
PostPosted: Wed Aug 19, 2020 20:42 
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Numbskull

Joined: 29th Aug, 2008
Posts: 742
Location: teutonia
BikNorton wrote:
You're making me think in a way that is helping with self -analysis and -interrogation, making it easier to say to myself "you know what, you're only considering popping down to the shop because that's what you do, not because you want to, because the relief ever arrives, or you even really enjoy it."

I'm not really pushing for tee-total at this stage but 4 days dry last week (Sunday, Monday, Wednesday, Friday) and this is the 3rd this week (Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday).

No withdrawal, but no feeling good about it. Stupid depression.

What I need is for the scales to twitch, and my t-shirts to snag my belly less - I've probably consumed 10,000 calories less over the last 10 days and it still says 118.8kg. I think I've subconsciously got a lot (very probably too much) riding on seeing the effects of training on *me*, not just the numbers.

Again, thanks. Hopefully your openness having some of the positive impact you hoped it would brings you... Something.


'm not really pushing for tee-total at this stage but 4 days dry last week (Sunday, Monday, Wednesday, Friday) and this is the 3rd this week (Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday).

No withdrawal, but no feeling good about it. Stupid depression.

What I need is for the scales to twitch, and my t-shirts to snag my belly less - I've probably consumed 10,000 calories less over the last 10 days and it still says 118.8kg. I think I've subconsciously got a lot (very probably too much) riding on seeing the effects of training on *me*, not just the numbers.

Again, thanks. Hopefully your openness having some of the positive impact you hoped it would brings you... Something.[/quote]

Do you mean me? If so, I'm delighted and yes, it does bring me something, so thanks to you as well. Again, I don't want to play the amateur psychologist, but it all sounds good to me. I like to hear good news.

I don't want to be negative at all, but 118kg is impressively heavy. I just hope that you're 9 feet tall...can't help but think of the snooker player Mark Allen - quite a belly he has on him - bet he drinks Carling Black Lable (probably one for the more ancient among you - no idea if it even still exists these day).

I'm glad if I helped in any way - whether or not, I send you my love and best wishes.


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 Post subject: Re: Alcoholic Liver Cirrhosis
PostPosted: Wed Aug 19, 2020 20:52 
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Numbskull

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Posts: 742
Location: teutonia
Mr Chonks wrote:
MrC wrote:
Mr Chonks wrote:
I’m three days off 9 months sober, and if it weren’t for the crippling depression and anxiety triggered by covid and arseholes at work I would probably be feeling amazing!

However, if I were still drinking I expect I’d feel even worse than I do now.


Hey Myp, of course I don't really know you and haven't met you, but that sounds really positive. I'm genuinely very happy to hear that.

The other thing you mentioned about weight loss (although stones and pounds mean bugger all to me these days) - I lost 20-ish kilos after my diagnosis. I'd rather have achieved that a different way, but y'know swings and roundabouts.

37lbs is about 17 kilos.

Has the weight loss been because of a change of lifestyle or due to the illness? Before I congratulate you…


17 kilos is quite amazing. Well fucking done on that.

You don't need to congratulate me - whatever I achieved was too little, too late. As for the weight loss, I'd say a bit of both. Definitely a change in lifestyle, food and drink, no booze and leaping out of bed at four in the morning for a walk or bike ride or sometimes both. Not so sure about the illness part, but I'd guess that the water pills took off a kilo or two. Dunno.


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 Post subject: Re: Alcoholic Liver Cirrhosis
PostPosted: Wed Aug 19, 2020 21:43 
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@mrc yes, I meant you. I'm 6'2" but with tiny legs; my hips are at the same height as my wife's but she only comes up to my shoulders (and has a somewhat disproportionately long spine herself).

The upside is that my personal trainer doing full body conditioning on me via Skype for 4 months means basically everything was also strength training.

"Fix my back, lose weight" were what I signed her up for. She's fixed my back, improved my posture, and many other things, but not convinced me to lose weight - either by nutrition or drinking less, both of which she's tried. It is simply the unfortunate case that until I want to, I won't.

Right now I kinda want to. We'll see if it lasts.

@jem ta, and actually I have previous - many moons ago I signed up for weight watchers (another of these pivot moments) and I had the same then, no change at all after a week despite drastic change. The next week I lost 6lb doing nothing different, and then 4-6lb a week for the next 18 months.

So fingers crossed.

@mr Chonks bloody well done!


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 Post subject: Re: Alcoholic Liver Cirrhosis
PostPosted: Wed Aug 19, 2020 22:15 
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Thanks. I didn’t really change my diet, but I was walking 10-15 miles a day and not drinking. Really made a difference.

Now I’m not walking anywhere near that distance, which is why some has crept back on.

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 Post subject: Re: Alcoholic Liver Cirrhosis
PostPosted: Thu Aug 20, 2020 2:49 
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[quote="BikNorton"]@mrc yes, I meant you. I'm 6'2" but with tiny legs; my hips are at the same height as my wife's but she only comes up to my shoulders (and has a somewhat disproportionately long spine herself).

The upside is that my personal trainer doing full body conditioning on me via Skype for 4 months means basically everything was also strength training.

"Fix my back, lose weight" were what I signed her up for. She's fixed my back, improved my posture, and many other things, but not convinced me to lose weight - either by nutrition or drinking less, both of which she's tried. It is simply the unfortunate case that until I want to, I won't.

Right now I kinda want to. We'll see if it lasts.



As I'm up at stupid o'clock (thanks for that, nausea), I thought I may as well try and do something vaguely productive.

@BikNorton - You've put a picture in my head of a giant with teeny-weeny legs and I just can't unsee it now. If I were an artist, I'd draw a picture, but the only kind of artist I ever was, was a...well, you know the story.

What's the deal with a personal trainer? Must cost a fortune.


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 Post subject: Re: Alcoholic Liver Cirrhosis
PostPosted: Thu Aug 20, 2020 2:53 
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Numbskull

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Mr Chonks wrote:
Thanks. I didn’t really change my diet, but I was walking 10-15 miles a day and not drinking. Really made a difference.

Now I’m not walking anywhere near that distance, which is why some has crept back on.


Bloody hell, just looked up a converter and 15 miles is 24km. How on earth did you get that high score? Is it related to work or in your free time. Either way, amazing.


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 Post subject: Re: Alcoholic Liver Cirrhosis
PostPosted: Thu Aug 20, 2020 9:19 
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Fitness Nut...

Joined: 25th Sep, 2008
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Mr Chonks wrote:
I’m three days off 9 months sober, and if it weren’t for the crippling depression and anxiety triggered by covid and arseholes at work I would probably be feeling amazing!

However, if I were still drinking I expect I’d feel even worse than I do now.


That is awesome.. the not drinking part.

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 Post subject: Re: Alcoholic Liver Cirrhosis
PostPosted: Thu Aug 20, 2020 10:09 
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Can't re-member

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MrC wrote:
Mr Chonks wrote:
Thanks. I didn’t really change my diet, but I was walking 10-15 miles a day and not drinking. Really made a difference.

Now I’m not walking anywhere near that distance, which is why some has crept back on.


Bloody hell, just looked up a converter and 15 miles is 24km. How on earth did you get that high score? Is it related to work or in your free time. Either way, amazing.

I am/was a postman.

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 Post subject: Re: Alcoholic Liver Cirrhosis
PostPosted: Thu Aug 20, 2020 10:23 
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Quote:
What's the deal with a personal trainer? Must cost a fortune.
not cheap no, but I had such problems with lower back pain and weird explodey feet it made sense, and since they've improved immeasurably having someone qualified to help my entire body build up, from cardio to muscles via connective tissue, is great.

Not to mention the motivational assistance, I'm sure by now I'd be in my typical rut of paying gym membership every month and not using it.


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 Post subject: Re: Alcoholic Liver Cirrhosis
PostPosted: Thu Aug 20, 2020 12:06 
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Numbskull

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Mr Chonks wrote:
MrC wrote:
Mr Chonks wrote:
Thanks. I didn’t really change my diet, but I was walking 10-15 miles a day and not drinking. Really made a difference.

Now I’m not walking anywhere near that distance, which is why some has crept back on.


Bloody hell, just looked up a converter and 15 miles is 24km. How on earth did you get that high score? Is it related to work or in your free time. Either way, amazing.

I am/was a postman.


Surely you're kidding, right? I always pictured you some kind of IT guy.

My wife gets a fair bit of mileage in her job as a nurse (the wards are massive).


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 Post subject: Re: Alcoholic Liver Cirrhosis
PostPosted: Thu Aug 20, 2020 12:09 
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I did 13 years in IT, then left my dignity at the door and took voluntary redundancy. Bummed around for a bit then applied for a job as a postman at my local office. The actual job was not too bad, but the company is rotten to the core.

I’m currently off sick and don’t think I’ll be going back.

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 Post subject: Re: Alcoholic Liver Cirrhosis
PostPosted: Thu Aug 20, 2020 12:13 
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Numbskull

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BikNorton wrote:
Quote:
What's the deal with a personal trainer? Must cost a fortune.
not cheap no, but I had such problems with lower back pain and weird explodey feet it made sense, and since they've improved immeasurably having someone qualified to help my entire body build up, from cardio to muscles via connective tissue, is great.

Not to mention the motivational assistance, I'm sure by now I'd be in my typical rut of paying gym membership every month and not using it.


Now there's a new one on me. What are explodey feet?

As for the gym membership, they rather count on that. If you want to get fit rather than muscly, riding a bike (bike norton! Sorry!) or walking are the better bets and free of charge.


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 Post subject: Re: Alcoholic Liver Cirrhosis
PostPosted: Thu Aug 20, 2020 12:19 
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Numbskull

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Mr Chonks wrote:
I did 13 years in IT, then left my dignity at the door and took voluntary redundancy. Bummed around for a bit then applied for a job as a postman at my local office. The actual job was not too bad, but the company is rotten to the core.

I’m currently off sick and don’t think I’ll be going back.


I also did a stint as a postie and loved it. Then they sent a bunch of us into the sorting office and I felt my will to live draining away day by day. And, boy, are you right about rotten to the core.

On the positive side, it was one on the main reasons that made me move to Germany, one of the best decisions of my life.


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 Post subject: Re: Alcoholic Liver Cirrhosis
PostPosted: Thu Aug 20, 2020 16:16 
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Every now and again I'll wake up with a foot causing me agony, and it goes a funny colour and twice the size it should be.

Nothing to do with booze, more to do with being fat and lazy. Lots of tests said "um, the tests say your foot isn't swollen".

Eventually I've twigged that jarring or even just standing on them funny (for example gardening on a slope) does it. So does leaving it a bit long to get new shoes.

Again though - my trainer avoids antagonising them, helps strengthen them, and has given me alleviations. It's way less frequent a problem than it was a year ago, rarely severe enough to need a magical (magical, delicious!) naproxen, and when it feels like it's going bad rolling my foot on a tennis ball while working eases it.

PT is one of the better spends, if not the best spend, I've ever made, to the point my wife has said she'll cover it herself should my job situation mean I have to consider dropping it.

Walking and bike riding round here require significant baseline fitness to be meaningful cardio. And I struggle to spend an hour *ending up where I already am*. Going to the gym is the destination. Important (no, honestly) distinction to my idiot brain.


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 Post subject: Re: Alcoholic Liver Cirrhosis
PostPosted: Thu Aug 20, 2020 16:44 
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Numbskull

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Location: teutonia
BikNorton wrote:
Every now and again I'll wake up with a foot causing me agony, and it goes a funny colour and twice the size it should be.

Nothing to do with booze, more to do with being fat and lazy. Lots of tests said "um, the tests say your foot isn't swollen".

Eventually I've twigged that jarring or even just standing on them funny (for example gardening on a slope) does it. So does leaving it a bit long to get new shoes.

Again though - my trainer avoids antagonising them, helps strengthen them, and has given me alleviations. It's way less frequent a problem than it was a year ago, rarely severe enough to need a magical (magical, delicious!) naproxen, and when it feels like it's going bad rolling my foot on a tennis ball while working eases it.

PT is one of the better spends, if not the best spend, I've ever made, to the point my wife has said she'll cover it herself should my job situation mean I have to consider dropping it.

Walking and bike riding round here require significant baseline fitness to be meaningful cardio. And I struggle to spend an hour *ending up where I already am*. Going to the gym is the destination. Important (no, honestly) distinction to my idiot brain.


Well that's an odd one. I just asked my nursey wife what that could be, and she had no idea either.

I would recommend an e-bike, the one I have is not one of the super- expensive ones, but does the job for me, and gets you up the hills. If you lack the basic fitness, as I also do, it can take some of the off your hands. Or legs. Just mentioning that makes me fancy a ride right now, but it's 35 degrees outside, which can fuck right off, and might well kill me.


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 Post subject: Re: Alcoholic Liver Cirrhosis
PostPosted: Sat Aug 22, 2020 10:22 
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Numbskull

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I did something the other day that was incredibly stupid

We had the painter in all morning and because of the nausea I hadn't drunk or eaten anything, but somehow decided that getting the e-bike out in the midday sun at 36 degrees was a good idea. My wife advised me against it and she was right. Maybe I was trying to prove something to myself.

Afterwards I barely made it up the stairs and had all sorts of cramps, took hours to recover and couldn't help thinking "you fucking idiot". It was a case of you live and you learn, or at least you live. I think I may have stolen a quote there, maybe Douglas Adams. Whoever it was, it wasn't wrong.


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 Post subject: Re: Alcoholic Liver Cirrhosis
PostPosted: Sun Aug 23, 2020 6:43 
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Numbskull

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Off topic, but like I care at the moment.

Just wanted to recommend the tv series "Upright" with Tim Minchin. Way better than I expected - has both teary and laugh out loud moments, and of course a couple of songs.

Here's one of them - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uFvHeqMfsJQ

Dunno about you lot, but it resonates with me right now, especialy the first half.

I know I'm over-emotional given the current circumstances, sorry about that, but I see that as a strength and not a weakness,


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 Post subject: Re: Alcoholic Liver Cirrhosis
PostPosted: Sun Aug 23, 2020 17:35 
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Soopah red DS

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I'm sure I reacted to Upright several times, and once or twice thought "Is this just me being over-emotional?", but it is fabulous.

One of those reactions was to the girl in the first episode. "Wow", I thought, "she's fantastic, I hope there's more of her". To doubt that there would be says nothing for my judgement.


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 Post subject: Re: Alcoholic Liver Cirrhosis
PostPosted: Mon Aug 24, 2020 6:23 
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Numbskull

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Location: teutonia
Fabulous is a good choice of word. I think we have three episodes to go, but you find yourself deliberately delaying it because you don't want it to end.


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