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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Thu Jan 11, 2018 14:28 
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Curiosity wrote:
And today, Nigel Farage is backing a second referendum.

What what? What?

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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Thu Jan 11, 2018 14:30 
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Lord Humongous

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Mimi wrote:
Curiosity wrote:
And today, Nigel Farage is backing a second referendum.

What what? What?

:this: :this: , :this:

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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Thu Jan 11, 2018 14:42 
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Heavy Metal Tough Guy

Joined: 31st Mar, 2008
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More to put a final nail in the coffin of those whinging remoaners than for any "final say on the form of the deal" reasons.
http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-politics-42649214


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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Thu Jan 11, 2018 14:57 
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EvilTrousers

Joined: 30th Mar, 2008
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Squirt wrote:
More to put a final nail in the coffin of those whinging remoaners than for any "final say on the form of the deal" reasons.
http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-politics-42649214


Like fuck.

As many have pointed out when Brexit inevitably fucks up people will start pointing fingers and it's a lot easier after another referendum that ends in a remain result to be sat on the sidelines throwing pelters without offering solutions.

He has no real source of income now but as soon as there's another referendum rent-a-gob is right back in the limelight and then when he loses it can all be the fault of The BBC, Liberal Elite, Mainstream Media, Women, Immigrants and the letter Y.

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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Thu Jan 11, 2018 15:05 
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Isn't he still an MEP? So if we remain he keeps his job and can keep moaning.

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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Thu Jan 11, 2018 16:09 
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Lonewolves wrote:
Isn't he still an MEP?


I continue to find this fact utterly fucking mind-boggling.


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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Thu Jan 11, 2018 16:10 
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Bamba wrote:
Lonewolves wrote:
Isn't he still an MEP?


I continue to find this fact utterly fucking mind-boggling.

Easy money innit.

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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Thu Jan 11, 2018 18:09 
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Ticket to Ride World Champion

Joined: 18th Apr, 2008
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Lonewolves wrote:
Bamba wrote:
Lonewolves wrote:
Isn't he still an MEP?


I continue to find this fact utterly fucking mind-boggling.

Easy money innit.

It is still fucking mind boggling, though.

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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Thu Jan 11, 2018 19:05 
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Everybodys gilf

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Well 750,000 twats in South East England voted UKIP in the 2014 European Parliament election. That's how.

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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Tue Jan 16, 2018 7:02 
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BBC: £350m Brexit claim was 'too low', says Boris Johnson

Oh, please kindly go on an extended trade mission to Siberia.


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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Tue Jan 16, 2018 10:17 
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Kern wrote:
BBC: £350m Brexit claim was 'too low', says Boris Johnson

Oh, please kindly go on an extended trade mission to Siberia.


I did like this excellent burn from Labour on the subject: "Our NHS is in the middle of a winter crisis and Boris Johnson's solution is to return to the scene of his previous crimes and promise ever larger slices of pie in the sky."


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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Fri Jan 19, 2018 11:10 
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Ian Dunt's short piece on the government's options and the current situation is a quick and useful read. Not particularly hopeful, uplifting, or likely to increase your confidence in Her Majesty's Government, but we can't have everything.


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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Fri Jan 19, 2018 12:16 
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Heavy Metal Tough Guy

Joined: 31st Mar, 2008
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I really can't see how this is going to end up with anything other than a shambling, fudged, "In-the-EU-in-all-but-name" compromise agreement that will make everyone involved angry, whilst giving precisely zero benefits.


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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Mon Jan 29, 2018 22:56 
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https://www.buzzfeed.com/albertonardell ... uk-will-be

Quote:
The government's new analysis of the impact of Brexit says the UK would be worse off outside the European Union under every scenario modelled, BuzzFeed News can reveal.

The assessment, which is titled “EU Exit Analysis – Cross Whitehall Briefing” and dated January 2018, looked at three of the most plausible Brexit scenarios based on existing EU arrangements.

Under a comprehensive free trade agreement with the EU, UK growth would be 5% lower over the next 15 years compared to current forecasts, according to the analysis.

The "no deal" scenario, which would see the UK revert to World Trade Organisation (WTO) rules, would reduce growth by 8% over that period. The softest Brexit option of continued single-market access through membership of the European Economic Area would, in the longer term, still lower growth by 2%.

These calculations do not take into account any short-term hits to the economy from Brexit, such as the cost of adjusting the economy to new customs arrangements.

The assessment seen by BuzzFeed News is being kept tightly guarded inside government. It was prepared by officials across Whitehall for the Department for Exiting the European Union (DExEU), and is reportedly being presented to key ministers in one-to-one meetings this week ahead of discussion at the Brexit cabinet subcommittee next week.

Asked why the prime minister was not making the analysis public, a DExEU source told BuzzFeed News: "Because it's embarrassing."



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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Tue Jan 30, 2018 6:50 
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'See, it's not a 25% loss. Stop spreading your PROJECT FEAR. No turning back'


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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Tue Jan 30, 2018 7:58 
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Gogmagog

Joined: 30th Mar, 2008
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Well. This is awkward for everyone.

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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Tue Jan 30, 2018 8:48 
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MaliA wrote:
Well. This is awkward for everyone.


I know. My MP hasn't replied to my most recent letter on this yet and I hate these things being superseded by events.


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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Tue Jan 30, 2018 8:56 
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What's frustrating is that this is the ideal opportunity for Mr Corbyn to demonstrate to his critics at he isn't a dogmatic ideologue and can turn round and say 'this is great in theory, but as it can't work without harming people, let's not do this', and yet he's still ruling out even just staying in the single market/customs union.


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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Tue Jan 30, 2018 9:05 
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Be reassured by this clear answer in the Commons yesterday, which I'm quoting in full:

Quote:
Paul Masterton (East Renfrewshire) (Con)

The British people are, in the main, not ideological but practical and pragmatic. They simply want Brexit to work. Will the Minister assure me that the Government’s policy will be dictated not by fringe groups, either in this place or outside it, but by the national interest?

Mr Walker (Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Exiting the European Union)
  
Yes.

Hansard link

Rest easy.


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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Tue Jan 30, 2018 9:19 
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Gogmagog

Joined: 30th Mar, 2008
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Kern wrote:
What's frustrating is that this is the ideal opportunity for Mr Corbyn to demonstrate to his critics at he isn't a dogmatic ideologue and can turn round and say 'this is great in theory, but as it can't work without harming people, let's not do this', and yet he's still ruling out even just staying in the single market/customs union.



https://twitter.com/campbellclaret/stat ... 7660695552



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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Tue Jan 30, 2018 9:30 
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Heh.

Skimming a piece in the Guardian about Mary Beard and came across possibly the best description of those obsessed with leave:

Quote:
The referendum then, should not be treated as the final word, she said, but as a straw vote. “Sure, say we want to leave, but you can only in the end say we are going to leave when we know what it means. Otherwise,” she said, “it’s just wanking in the dark."


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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Tue Jan 30, 2018 10:10 
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Gogmagog

Joined: 30th Mar, 2008
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Ace. Although, I just got Beard confused with Berry, which made it odd.

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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Wed Jan 31, 2018 9:06 
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It seems the very best line May could find was that this is “preliminary” analysis so should be discounted.

https://twitter.com/simon_nixon/status/ ... 2695625728




We’re over a year and a half from the referendum. How long does it take to produce some trustworthy, solid, non-preliminary analysis?


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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Wed Jan 31, 2018 9:18 
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What's concerning me is that it seems roughly in line with other analyses, such as those produced by the EU, the Bank of England, various thinktanks, and universities. Perhaps I'm limiting myself in what I'm exposing myself to, but if everything is pointing in one direction there's either a heck of a flaw in the underlying assumptions or the destination is clear.

I really would like something as cold and detailed as Ian Dunt's book. The only pro-Brexit stuff I've read tends to be of the unicorns-in-air-castles variety. Wish we could go back to not caring about the intricacies of cross-border aeroplane regulation and suchlike.


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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Wed Jan 31, 2018 9:33 
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None of it matters. People didn't vote to leave the EU on the basis of a hard-headed assessment of the economics and they aren't going to accept not leaving on the basis of that either. Brexiters only really need to point to the referendum result to justify their position.


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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Wed Jan 31, 2018 9:55 
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The result was 52-48 on a very blunt question. No plan for leaving was ever put forward: people were voting blind. Mrs May could, when she became prime minister, have recognised the massive splits in the country and sought a compromise plan that probably would have satisfied nobody but at least showed a willingness to bring people together, for example leaving the EU but staying in the EEA. Some benefits of membership, some of leaving (eg, not in the Union per se), but more in line with the outcome.

Instead, for reasons of keeping the Conservatives together, she opted for a hardest possible Brexit. It isn't unreasonable to think that such decisions should be made after an examination of all the options, especially when your main criticism of the opposition is they do things out of ideology, not evidence. I also don't think it's wise for Parliament to let the government proceed without a full understanding of the implications and options. It's very concerning when ministers are afraid to show their workings or justify their positions: they should be able to argue for their position based on the merits of the hard Brexit itself, rather having to resort to vague language or muttering about the 'will of the people' (and it's somewhat nauseating to hear Tories rely on the views of Jean-Jacques Rousseau!).


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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Wed Jan 31, 2018 10:00 
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Gogmagog

Joined: 30th Mar, 2008
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Good post. Kier Starmer was shit on R4 this am.

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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Wed Jan 31, 2018 10:02 
Excellent Member

Joined: 5th Dec, 2010
Posts: 3253
Anyone know what they plan to do with passports for the UK?

I've seen the news that we will all get Blue ones back for anything issues after we leave in 2019, although also read there is a chance these could be made in Berlin :D

What happens with current EU passports after we leave though? Mine was renewed last year so is good to 2027. Will I get EU movement for this time or will I have any restrictions that come with our exit in 2019?

Not a big deal but the automatic passport control systems in most major EU airports make travel a lot easier for EU passport holders.

Getting Irish passports for my kids, they can get these no issues as my wife holds one.


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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Wed Jan 31, 2018 10:05 
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Joined: 30th Mar, 2008
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Kern wrote:
The result was 52-48 on a very blunt question. No plan for leaving was ever put forward: people were voting blind. Mrs May could, when she became prime minister, have recognised the massive splits in the country and sought a compromise plan that probably would have satisfied nobody but at least showed a willingness to bring people together, for example leaving the EU but staying in the EEA. Some benefits of membership, some of leaving (eg, not in the Union per se), but more in line with the outcome.

Instead, for reasons of keeping the Conservatives together, she opted for a hardest possible Brexit. It isn't unreasonable to think that such decisions should be made after an examination of all the options, especially when your main criticism of the opposition is they do things out of ideology, not evidence. I also don't think it's wise for Parliament to let the government proceed without a full understanding of the implications and options. It's very concerning when ministers are afraid to show their workings or justify their positions: they should be able to argue for their position based on the merits of the hard Brexit itself, rather having to resort to vague language or muttering about the 'will of the people' (and it's somewhat nauseating to hear Tories rely on the views of Jean-Jacques Rousseau!).
What do you mean that she "opted for the hardest possible Brexit"? As far as I can tell (which is not really very far) she seems to be just bungling her way through from one disaster to the next with no clear plan and hoping that the outcome will be some sort of a fudge.

I'm all for mitigating the disaster that they have wrought but a country is more than an economy and when I think it through I'm coming to believe that outright avoiding Brexit altogether would more damaging than going ahead. The divisions and hatred that these fucking clowns brought to the surface with their idiotic referendum would just get so much worse.


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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Wed Jan 31, 2018 10:06 
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I'm a computery guy!

Joined: 27th Jun, 2008
Posts: 33265
asfish wrote:
Getting Irish passports for my kids, they can get these no issues as my wife holds one.


Unless you travel with the kids without your wife. Be prepared to answer a lot of questions.

When we flew back from New York, the missus was questioned because her ticket was in her maiden name, but her passport was in her married name. It was our honeymoon.


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