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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Fri Jun 19, 2020 16:08 
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Mr Chonks wrote:
Tbf if I’d had to go to mainstream school I wouldn’t have survived. I was very lucky my parents had the means to pay for my education (well, they got themselves up to the eyeballs in debt, but still).


Surely you agree that taxpayers shouldn't be subsidising private schools though.

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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Fri Jun 19, 2020 16:15 
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Cras wrote:
Mr Chonks wrote:
Tbf if I’d had to go to mainstream school I wouldn’t have survived. I was very lucky my parents had the means to pay for my education (well, they got themselves up to the eyeballs in debt, but still).


Surely you agree that taxpayers shouldn't be subsidising private schools though.

Absolutely. Parents and shareholders should pay more, obviously.

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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Fri Jun 19, 2020 18:22 
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Cras wrote:
Mr Chonks wrote:
Tbf if I’d had to go to mainstream school I wouldn’t have survived. I was very lucky my parents had the means to pay for my education (well, they got themselves up to the eyeballs in debt, but still).


Surely you agree that taxpayers shouldn't be subsidising private schools though.


They most definitely should not.

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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Fri Jun 19, 2020 18:23 
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Mr Chonks wrote:
Cras wrote:
Mr Chonks wrote:
Tbf if I’d had to go to mainstream school I wouldn’t have survived. I was very lucky my parents had the means to pay for my education (well, they got themselves up to the eyeballs in debt, but still).


Surely you agree that taxpayers shouldn't be subsidising private schools though.

Absolutely. Parents and shareholders should pay more, obviously.


Private schools are run as charities.

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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Fri Jun 19, 2020 18:44 
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MaliA wrote:
Mr Chonks wrote:
Cras wrote:
Mr Chonks wrote:
Tbf if I’d had to go to mainstream school I wouldn’t have survived. I was very lucky my parents had the means to pay for my education (well, they got themselves up to the eyeballs in debt, but still).


Surely you agree that taxpayers shouldn't be subsidising private schools though.

Absolutely. Parents and shareholders should pay more, obviously.


Private schools are run as charities.

Tax efficient. Your mate Tony would like it.

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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Wed Jun 24, 2020 12:17 
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Fuck me Johnson is just flat out bad at PMQs, he seems to confuse getting angry, bangy, and throwing out long words he vaguely remembers from boarding school with actual debate with someone who is clearly massively more on the ball and up to the job than he is.

Also he flat out just won't answer the questions for, well, obvious reasons.

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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Wed Jun 24, 2020 12:53 
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Hearthly wrote:
Fuck me Johnson is just flat out bad at PMQs, he seems to confuse getting angry, bangy, and throwing out long words he vaguely remembers from boarding school with actual debate with someone who is clearly massively more on the ball and up to the job than he is.


Aye. It's staggering how poor he is. I always thought a major flaw with Corbyn was a reluctance to use follow-ups wisely, and Johnson keeps falling into basic traps time and again. I don't think Johnson can be bothered to prepare, just as I don't think he's interested in governing.

Quote:
Also he flat out just won't answer the questions for, well, obvious reasons.


He's not even very good at not answering questions, sticking to one or two set lines that often aren't even in the same county as the expected response. Besides, why is being a lawyer insulting? Not like journalists are highly thought of across the general public.


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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Wed Jun 24, 2020 13:04 
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Hearthly wrote:
Also he flat out just won't answer the questions for, well, obvious reasons.


The most concerning response he gave was to the angry DUP MP. Either Johnson doesn't understand what he signed up to regarding Northern Ireland, or he is deeply in denial about it.


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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Wed Jun 24, 2020 13:45 
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That's the thing, Starmer can think on his feet and he's clearly going in very well prepared. You get the feeling Johnson is being briefed on the stuff they know is going to come up, and thus appears somewhat prepared, but only to a superficial level, and Starmer quickly scrubs that away, week after week, to reveal Johnson's ignorance, and all that's left is bluster.

I also note how Johnson constantly plays to the gallery, he needs the whoops and hollers from the stooges on his backbenches, whereas Starmer is 100% focused on the task at hand and obviously has confidence in his own knowledge and ability.

I'm at a loss to understand why Johnson seems to think that turning it into 'Opposition's Questions' is a good idea, especially when he starts falling back on the same lame questions week after week, it doesn't look like a position of strength to get all flustered and shouty with the leader of the opposition and demand he answer the Prime Minister's questions.....

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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Thu Jun 25, 2020 15:31 
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RLB been given a ticket on HMS DoOne.

https://twitter.com/SkyNewsBreak/status ... 0850808836



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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Thu Jun 25, 2020 15:42 
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I have no opinion either way at the moment because I don’t know all the facts. Apparently she shared an article that said the US police learn some of their tactics from the IDF. I don’t know if this is true or not, but it’s not a good look from an MP from a party with a history of AS, regardless if you believe criticising the Israeli state is classed as AS or not.

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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Thu Jun 25, 2020 15:55 
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Mr Chonks wrote:
I have no opinion either way at the moment because I don’t know all the facts. Apparently she shared an article that said the US police learn some of their tactics from the IDF. I don’t know if this is true or not, but it’s not a good look from an MP from a party with a history of AS, regardless if you believe criticising the Israeli state is classed as AS or not.



It's this one here I believe.

Peake wrote:
“The tactics used by the police in America, kneeling on George Floyd’s neck, that was learnt from seminars with Israeli secret services.”


And the article notes
Quote:
(A spokesperson for the Israeli police has denied this, stating that “there is no tactic or protocol that calls to put pressure on the neck or airway”.)

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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Thu Jun 25, 2020 17:01 
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Yes, I’ve done some reading since. Interestingly an earlier version of that article states Amnesty International was the source, and did not mention the IDF’s response.

Regardless of whether it’s an overreaction or not, strong leadership on this is probably a good idea in order to regain trust in the Jewish community. In my opinion criticising the Israeli state or military doesn’t conflate to AS, but many anti-semites use it as a cover. Anyone who is a Labour MP should think very hard about whether criticising Israel is a sensible idea currently with the historical AS issues.

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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Thu Jun 25, 2020 20:42 
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The weirdest bit is that Labour asked RLB to tweet a retraction/clarification, which they approved. Then changed their minds and asked her to delete that and the original tweet. Not particularly well handled if that’s the truth.

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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Thu Jun 25, 2020 21:37 
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Really good explanation here IMO.

RLB should have known better and Starmer made the correct decision. As unfair as it may be, Labour are held to a higher standard than the amoral useless fucking wankers that pass for a government at the moment, and it's with actions like this that Starmer will make Labour electable again.

It's not necessarily pretty, but then neither is a Tory government that's killing tens of thousands of people with its criminal incompetence, Starmer understands what's required to make Labour electable. It's all very well 'winning the argument' and 'being on the right side of history', but it's governments that get to make policy, not the opposition.

https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1276 ... 25189.html

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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Sat Jun 27, 2020 9:42 
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The TL;DR of a leader in today's Oxford Mail is "some of our readers are a bit racist".


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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Sun Jun 28, 2020 1:10 
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Fuck me, the comments make me want to go and set Oxford on fire. I really thought of all the places Oxford wasn't one of them


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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Sun Jun 28, 2020 11:15 
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Keir Starmer now polling higher than Boris 'Clown Car' Johnson in preference for prime minister.

I mean, I knew a Johnson led government would be a cesspool of incompetence and corruption, but I wasn't expecting them to go to utter shit quite so quickly, although Covid has been brutal in revealing just how completely unsuited to the task at hand Johnson and his cabinet of nodding dogs are.

Also, Starmer's 'negative' qualities, being a bit serious and boring, all of a sudden become exactly the sort of thing you want in a leader at times of crisis. Johnson's a decent gameshow host, but a fucking terrible prime minister.

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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Mon Jun 29, 2020 12:20 
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We need someone like Ian McDonald, "the voice of the Falklands War." Very serious and respected, he was.


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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Sat Jul 04, 2020 8:29 
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Great line from Jonathan Freedland in the Guardian today about the reopening of the pubs:

Quote:
...his government of geniuses picked Saturday solely because of the pleasing headlines that the Fourth of July suggested – rather forgetting that this is the day when Americans celebrate their escape from the rule of a dysfunctional London elite headed by a man with more children than you could count and prone to gibbering in public.


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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Mon Jul 13, 2020 10:04 
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https://yougov.co.uk/topics/politics/ar ... 36-8-9-jul

Seems like nothing that happens even matters any more. Who will we blame at the next election when Labour get their arses handed to them again? Hope I'm wrong but it seems people are excited about things like Starmer being good at PMQs and failing to recongise that nobody fucking watches PMQs or believes in facts etc.


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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Mon Jul 13, 2020 10:26 
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I just look at that and think, 'Who the fuck are that 46%?'

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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Mon Jul 13, 2020 13:45 
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I used to work for Yougov. The Sexual Attitudes Survey was a fun.

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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Mon Jul 13, 2020 14:25 
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Warhead wrote:
I used to work for Yougov. The Sexual Attitudes Survey was a fun.

How close do sexual attitudes allign with voting preference?


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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Mon Jul 13, 2020 14:36 
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DavPaz wrote:
Warhead wrote:
I used to work for Yougov. The Sexual Attitudes Survey was a fun.

How close do sexual attitudes allign with voting preference?


There's a whole discussion of this in Cowley & Ford's 2014 book, "Sex, Lies, and the Ballot Box". Annoyingly I don't have a copy to hand any more but it's a fun read.


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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Mon Jul 13, 2020 16:04 
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Care home staff will be excluded from the government’s post-Brexit fast-track visa system for health workers, the government has confirmed.

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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Mon Jul 13, 2020 16:54 
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They're probably thinking that there will be no shortage of people already here who'll be needing any paying job going once Brexit kicks in.


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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Mon Jul 13, 2020 19:36 
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Kern wrote:
DavPaz wrote:
Warhead wrote:
I used to work for Yougov. The Sexual Attitudes Survey was a fun.

How close do sexual attitudes allign with voting preference?


There's a whole discussion of this in Cowley & Ford's 2014 book, "Sex, Lies, and the Ballot Box". Annoyingly I don't have a copy to hand any more but it's a fun read.

That's just what I was going to say.

(No, it wasn't.)

I actually had no idea, of course. There was no question about voting preferences in the survey.

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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Wed Jul 15, 2020 21:03 
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Chris Grayling fails to win an election he was shoe-horned in for. The Tory elected the chair of the Intelligence & Security Committee instead of him has now lost the whip, presumably for showing intelligence. Where will Grayling fall upwards to next? Secretary-General of the UN? Head of FIFA? Pope?

Guardian link


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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Wed Jul 15, 2020 22:55 
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Hilarious at first, and then worrying, as they remove the whip from Lewis, making them look petulant and vindictive (again).


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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Wed Jul 15, 2020 23:57 
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Isn't that lovely?

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And rumours they might kick him off the committee. Which apparently only needs a commons majority to do so.

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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Thu Jul 16, 2020 9:19 
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This articulates quite well my increasing concerns over Starmer and his leadership. In some ways he’s made a promising start, but there are worrying signs.

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfr ... oy-jenkins

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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Thu Jul 16, 2020 9:23 
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This is one of those things that might appear minor in the grand scheme of things but consistent misjudgements like this make it easier for backbench grumbles to turn into something more troubling for a PM. We're still, after all, in the early days of this Parliament.

Chair of ISC is an easy post to give someone as a reward or to otherwise placate them. By trying to shoehorn someone so abjectly inappropriate, Johnson will have overlooked and annoyed other potential backbench candidates. Lashing out with removing the whip, whilst probably not being unavoidable given you need MPs to follow the line in public, will make him look weak when Lewis is eventually returned to the fold. Trying to remove him now will just look pathetic, especially if the member is held in high regard. Moral: you need to keep your backbenches on side.

Of course, I'm sure Cummings has already written a 10,000 word blog post (dated 2012) setting out how he's far smarter than everyone, can do the job blindfolded, and wants it disbanded in favour of the Pacman ghost algorithm.


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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Tue Jul 21, 2020 11:22 
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Just listening to the Russian report stuff. Seems the reason there's no evidence for Russian interference in 2016 unlike in 2014 or 2019 is the government didn't bother looking into it. Almost like the Great Orange One's approach to virus testing.


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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Wed Jul 22, 2020 12:21 
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Fucking hell Johnson is unremittingly awful at PMQs, almost embarrassingly so. Plus when the facade of 'nice guy Boris' falls away you can see he's an angry, nasty piece of work.

Starmer's doing really good work as Labour leader, we've seen more solid action today on antisemitism, and he made mincemeat of Johnson again at PMQs.

Hopefully this'll be reflected more in the polls as the time rolls on towards the next election, although Labour have come a long way already since the dying days of the Corbyn era.

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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Wed Jul 22, 2020 12:30 
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Hearthly wrote:
Fucking hell Johnson is unremittingly awful at PMQs, almost embarrassingly so. Plus when the facade of 'nice guy Boris' falls away you can see he's an angry, nasty piece of work.

Starmer's doing really good work as Labour leader, we've seen more solid action today on antisemitism, and he made mincemeat of Johnson again at PMQs.


Yes, it's almost painful to hear him. I don't recall Cameron or Blair just getting angry at a question rather than find a way to knock it aside. I think the reality of his failure is creeping up on him and he does not like being reminded of it. He also needs to drop those "funny oneliners" because he just shoehorns them in regardless of context and they never actually land.


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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Wed Jul 22, 2020 14:04 
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Kern wrote:
He also needs to drop those "funny oneliners" because he just shoehorns them in regardless of context and they never actually land.


I totally agree, he has more flip flops than Bournemouth beach.


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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Thu Jul 23, 2020 9:25 
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Ah, we have an Ministry of Truth now


https://amp.theguardian.com/politics/20 ... =true&s=09

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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Thu Jul 23, 2020 9:29 
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Just so fucked off with the whole thing now. This country is full of fucking imbeciles but it doesn't matter if you aren't, we're all destined to be scrabbling around in the same dust and ruins of whatever is left now that they got their way. Wish we could just up and leave. Absolutely fucking shit country, this.


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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Thu Jul 23, 2020 9:42 
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Kinda always has been


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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Fri Jul 31, 2020 8:12 
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Just watched Obama's eulogy for US civil rights leader John Lewis. An incredibly powerful tribute to such a legendary figure in US history.

Transcript here and worth reading but better to watch it, if only to remind yourself how great a speaker Obama is.


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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Fri Jul 31, 2020 12:37 
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Can't wait to see Trump's.

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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Fri Jul 31, 2020 15:36 
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"John Lewis was a person, man, on TV. But not many people here know, and I know, look it up. Look it up! Know that he was also a shop. A good shop. A big shop."


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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Thu Aug 27, 2020 16:14 
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Ed Davey is the new Lib Dem leader. I'd quite forgotten about the contest, or even the party.


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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Thu Aug 27, 2020 18:44 
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Kern wrote:
Ed Davey is the new Lib Dem leader. I'd quite forgotten about the contest, or even the party.

Also the incredibly boring choice. They’re in a weird position of having their most amount of members ever, but a handful of MPs and are polling terribly.

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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Sun Aug 30, 2020 12:09 
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https://twitter.com/VictoriaPrentis/sta ... 2483649538




Fishing without a line (or a clue) @kern


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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Sun Aug 30, 2020 18:58 
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Delightful :)

We are a very landlocked constituency.


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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Wed Sep 02, 2020 12:37 
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Another excruciatingly awful performance at PMQs by Mr Johnson. Starmer was rightly angry about the IRA accusation that came out of nowhere. I suppose they're going to keep on whispering stuff like that as the government sinks further into the quagmire.


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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Wed Sep 02, 2020 14:43 
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It almost* crossed the line into me feeling a bit sorry for Johnson. It's so obvious he doesn't really want to be there, doesn't want to actually 'do' the job (i.e. put any fucking effort in), can't comprehend the nerve of Starmer to ask him to explain himself, and whoever advised him to literally refuse to answer all the questions whilst vaguely attacking Starmer about entirely unrelated matters isn't earning their wage.

It's like he's heard the Prime Minister's Questions bit and decided it means he should ask the leader of the opposition questions.

Even Johnson's backbenchers couldn't seem to rustle up much enthusiasm for his rambling nonsense.

* Almost.

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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Wed Sep 02, 2020 14:47 
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I guess we should note, on a human level, that it's rumoured Johnson is suffering of the effects of 'Long Covid', which apparently are pretty horrible. Add in further rumours of an escalation in his drinking, things not being too great with Carrie, and he's got a young child to help look after - honestly, if he just resigned citing ill health and wanting to spend more time with his family, I don't think anyone would blame him.

They've got an obvious heir apparent in Rishi Sunak.

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