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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Wed Sep 04, 2019 14:01 
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JohnCoffey wrote:
Couldn't give a fuck. It'll probably just lead to my suicide.

I wouldn't miss this world and would be far better off.

And if you can take a few of us EU-sourced-medicine-dependent types with you, all the better, eh?


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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Wed Sep 04, 2019 14:03 
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sneering elitist

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JohnCoffey wrote:
Oh and as a continuation of my point if my cousin works over 16 hours she loses her family credit and can't afford to live. Tell me, how well does that work?

The whole show is rotten from top to bottom and needs serious sorting out.


Do you want to clarify exactly what benefit your cousin is on here? Assuming you mean child tax credit, there is no hours cap specifically, it's assessed by income. If you mean working tax credit, which she'd earn as a working parent, she'd need to be working a minimum of 16 hours. If she's on universal credit, it is again done by income i.e. the more you earn the less universal credit you get.

I have a lot of experience of the tax credits system and although it has its flaws, what you're saying doesn't add up.

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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Wed Sep 04, 2019 14:07 
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Cras wrote:
You've just said that there aren't valid reasons for leaving the EU and that people voted because it was a protest vote at government, then said there are valid reasons for voting to leave the EU.


No I already said that people do have very plausible reasons to want to leave the EU.

Once again it comes down to what you wanted, if you voted.

We as a society voted out. The majority was out, so out it is. That's how a democracy works whether you like it or not.


Trump = cunt. But, he's the president by a supposed fair vote so it is what it is

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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Wed Sep 04, 2019 14:08 
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Is this thing on?


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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Wed Sep 04, 2019 14:09 
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Esoteric

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Nik wrote:
JohnCoffey wrote:
Couldn't give a fuck. It'll probably just lead to my suicide.

I wouldn't miss this world and would be far better off.

And if you can take a few of us EU-sourced-medicine-dependent types with you, all the better, eh?


Now you're implying it would be my fault.

When we all clearly know who is at fault here.

Don't you get it or something? Has the events of the last few months not been enough?

Jas - I've no idea what benefits she is receiving. Family credit, IIRC.

Ed. My apologies Jem. I'm on a phone and it sucks ass.

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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Wed Sep 04, 2019 14:11 
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sneering elitist

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JohnCoffey wrote:
Jas - I've no idea what benefits she is receiving. Family credit, IIRC.

Family credit doesn't exist any more.

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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Wed Sep 04, 2019 14:11 
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Apologies, not my intention to imply that it's your fault, more that you don't care about the bad things caused by Brexit, including putting others' lives at risk.

Does that strike you as a tad selfish?


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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Wed Sep 04, 2019 14:15 
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Commander-in-Cheese

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JohnCoffey wrote:

We as a society voted out. The majority was out, so out it is. That's how a democracy works whether you like it or not


Completely wrong. We live in a representative democracy where we have elected representatives who use their experience to assess the best path for their country. An advisory referendum is an indication to parliament as to what the public want. And what the public wanted was split down the middle and marginally in favour of leave

In a representative democracy that sheet of results can be read, ignored, or turned into a paper aeroplane by MPs.

That is how our democracy works. And it's how it should work. Direct rule by the masses would be moronic.

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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Wed Sep 04, 2019 14:16 
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sneering elitist

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JohnCoffey wrote:
Ed. My apologies Jem. I'm on a phone and it sucks ass.

I've been called worse :)

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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Wed Sep 04, 2019 14:16 
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Nik wrote:
Apologies, not my intention to imply that it's your fault, more that you don't care about the bad things caused by Brexit, including putting others' lives at risk.

Does that strike you as a tad selfish?


No, it fucking doesn't. The reason I feel the way I do is because of how terribly let down I've been. Any progress I made has been completely reversed through lack of support and help and I'm now worse than ever.

So no I don't feel selfish at all. The whole world seems to be all about every man for himself.

There are bad things about being in the EU. That's how life works nothing is ever perfect. The German MOT for example is terrible as we covered before. And so on and so forth. I'm sure there are countless other things that do not work on our favour also. It's that old case of "I'm OK Jack" really. Those who want to remain were happy with the way things were and thus doing OK.

There are lots of people who weren't. As I said, that's usually what a vote comes down to. What you want for you.

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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Wed Sep 04, 2019 14:19 
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So you voted leave not out of any particular belief that doing so would improve your lot but mostly just because it might fuck up people you view as being more fortunate, gotcha.


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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Wed Sep 04, 2019 14:24 
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Yes, I was happy not having to worry about whether I'd have enough insulin to stay alive. I did not, however, believe everything to be perfect (not least after six years of Tory austerity), just because I was ok. This seems to be an alien concept to you.

JC, I'm really sorry things are so bad for you, but there is no point in debating any moral point with you, as you clearly have no empathy for others at all.

I wish you well, and hope life improves for you.


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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Wed Sep 04, 2019 14:28 
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Isn't that lovely?

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To me it comes down to a question I asked my vote leave Aunty on Facebook:

I'm still waiting for one tangible benefit of leaving.
Quote:
What positive impact will it have on my life?
What will I be able to do that I can't do now?
What can I finally stop doing after being forced to do it all these years?


But it can be rephrased as:

Quote:
What positive impact will it have on your life?
What will you be able to do that you can't do now?
What can you finally stop doing after being forced to do it all these years?


I'd be very interested in anyone's answers to that.

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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Wed Sep 04, 2019 14:30 
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Nik wrote:
JC, I'm really sorry things are so bad for you, but there is no point in debating any moral point with you, as you clearly have no empathy for others at all.


LOL wut? is that really the best you can muster? more insults?

Get a clue dude.

No empathy? bollocks. I'll tell you what keeps me awake at night. Worrying about my family members who live in poor areas of London. And, that some day one of them may be stabbed and or killed. In areas that are so poor, and so run down that the govt has washed its hands of it and just offers their sympathy when another kid dies. Why is this happening? no hope. Kids are being raised in areas that are so poor they have no life expectancy and have no issues murdering someone over a dirty look. Or, being killed themselves. We have created an under society with no morals, no empathy, no sympathy and nothing else. Children are killing each other, but that's OK because once again "I'm OK Jack !". I know what to do ! let's put a warning about stabbing people on fried chicken boxes 8) No, no that's not racist at all because after all they're all black, right? 8)

See that, that bothers me. How can we live in a society that has allowed that to fucking happen? once again it's that good old liberal passive aggressive in action again. We told them don't stab each other, that ought to do it. We've stuck a message on fried chicken boxes, that'll fix the problem because after all, it's only black kids doing it and they eat chicken all of the time 8)

Don't you dare tell me I have no empathy.

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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Wed Sep 04, 2019 14:45 
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I think the point everyone is trying to make is that No Deal Brexit will do nothing to help that, and almost certainly make it worse in most cases ( and much worse in some ). Which is why no one can work out why you seem to be pro-Leave. Our current approach might not be working, but driving the country off a cliff at 60mph is sure as hell not going to work any better.


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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Wed Sep 04, 2019 14:48 
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Cras wrote:
JohnCoffey wrote:

We as a society voted out. The majority was out, so out it is. That's how a democracy works whether you like it or not


Completely wrong. We live in a representative democracy where we have elected representatives who use their experience to assess the best path for their country. An advisory referendum is an indication to parliament as to what the public want. And what the public wanted was split down the middle and marginally in favour of leave

In a representative democracy that sheet of results can be read, ignored, or turned into a paper aeroplane by MPs.

That is how our democracy works. And it's how it should work. Direct rule by the masses would be moronic.


Then as I hinted to the govt should have taken their time, laid it all out, then put the vote out. But no. Cameron was so certain every one would back him up he rushed into a vote, gave people a choice.. Egg... Face. Like I said earlier the vote should not have happened when it did.

I can also tell you that all of the fear mongering going on (whether correct or incorrect, no one quite knows for sure !) has had no affect on those I speak to who voted to leave.

Me? I didn't bother. Why? because I learned from a pretty young age all about "Giant Douche VS Turd Sandwich" and you were going to get fucked no matter what.

That is why many have stopped voting, yet these tits in parliament don't understand why and keep assuring people if they vote their dreams will come true. It's just a dumb ass popularity contest for these attention seeking spoiled cunts. Keep calling for more votes. Call for another election.. Yeah that'll help. My mind boggles to think of how much cash has been wasted throughout this whole "democratic" process. Money that could have been spent on making a real difference (see my post above, giving young poor people hope rather than knives).

Squirt - I guess we'll find out at one point. As I said, nobody can put together a clear, concise argument as to whether we are better off in or out. So I guess we will have to find out first hand, given the govt have completely fucked it all up.

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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Wed Sep 04, 2019 15:11 
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JohnCoffey wrote:
Curiosity wrote:
The idea that all of the bad things will go away if we just crash the economy and No Deal Brexit is quite something.

It would lead to more austerity, more ‘crackdowns’ on those out of work or claiming disability allowances, etc. The only people to benefit will be those rich enough to exploit the resultant gaps in the market, or those who have bet against the British economy. That’s why a lot of very rich people keep on banging on about getting No Deal.

Successive British governments have chosen not to use their influence in Europe, and have chosen not to implement the power that they do have re: immigration, fishing, etc. It’s not some weird shadowy EU conspiracy to fuck us over and steal out fish; it’s government policies. The concept that it will change if a millionaire Tory no longer has any connection to Brussels is just pure fantasy.


I'm fucked either way. Have been since the recession in 2008. I knew it was coming, I was right. I now visit my mental health centre four times a year if I'm lucky. My social worker vanished over a year ago and wasn't replaced etc etc etc.

How can people sit and tell me it's going to get fucking worse when it's already about as bad as it can be?

They throw pills at me like sweets and prefer that I'm just drugged out of my mind so I'll go away. Forgetting that the meds I take cost more than any therapy.


Apparently they also throw bikes, PCs and PlayStations at you, nice new homes and even better you don't even have to work as some poor pole is doing it for you!

Not for long though, because what you fail to recognise is that the low paying jobs are still here because the poles, et al moved here. When/if this work force that is willing to work for less goes, the jobs will go as well. Then the tax revenue goes, so all the nice things you are currently given go as well. The meds go as well, the, admittedly limited, support goes as well.

For someone horrendously let down by the system, you sure have a lot of nice things. Ironically, a much better situation than a "10/room Pole on £5 an hour".

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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Wed Sep 04, 2019 15:13 
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No, JC, loads of people have put forward very compelling arguments for remaining in the EU, that are not based on “I’m alright Jack” but on the facts.

But the Leave side don’t really seem to care about them, or be able to point to exactly what will be better if we leave with no deal.

Your main argument seems to be that you hate disaster capitalism (which for some reason you call ‘liberal’) and have decided that the best way to frustrate these disaster capitalists is to...

...

... give them exactly what they want.

It just doesn’t seem a sound strategy.

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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Wed Sep 04, 2019 15:28 
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Bobbyaro wrote:
JohnCoffey wrote:
Curiosity wrote:
The idea that all of the bad things will go away if we just crash the economy and No Deal Brexit is quite something.

It would lead to more austerity, more ‘crackdowns’ on those out of work or claiming disability allowances, etc. The only people to benefit will be those rich enough to exploit the resultant gaps in the market, or those who have bet against the British economy. That’s why a lot of very rich people keep on banging on about getting No Deal.

Successive British governments have chosen not to use their influence in Europe, and have chosen not to implement the power that they do have re: immigration, fishing, etc. It’s not some weird shadowy EU conspiracy to fuck us over and steal out fish; it’s government policies. The concept that it will change if a millionaire Tory no longer has any connection to Brussels is just pure fantasy.


I'm fucked either way. Have been since the recession in 2008. I knew it was coming, I was right. I now visit my mental health centre four times a year if I'm lucky. My social worker vanished over a year ago and wasn't replaced etc etc etc.

How can people sit and tell me it's going to get fucking worse when it's already about as bad as it can be?

They throw pills at me like sweets and prefer that I'm just drugged out of my mind so I'll go away. Forgetting that the meds I take cost more than any therapy.


Apparently they also throw bikes, PCs and PlayStations at you, nice new homes and even better you don't even have to work as some poor pole is doing it for you!

Not for long though, because what you fail to recognise is that the low paying jobs are still here because the poles, et al moved here. When/if this work force that is willing to work for less goes, the jobs will go as well. Then the tax revenue goes, so all the nice things you are currently given go as well. The meds go as well, the, admittedly limited, support goes as well.

For someone horrendously let down by the system, you sure have a lot of nice things. Ironically, a much better situation than a "10/room Pole on £5 an hour".


That's rather personal isn't it?

That's half of the problem in things like this. People assume they know things they don't.

The spending? all part of the illness. I desperately wanted help for that but nope, didn't get it. I've been in the mental health system for 11 years and not once have I been offered CBT. I've asked for it, begged, pleaded but nope. Also, just so you know, if you give money to some one who has never really had any what do you expect them to do with it? Hint, they'll spend it.

I am living in a trust property. It is run by a charity. Why? because our govt haven't done it, so basically without relying on charity I would be homeless. I would rather have therapy and some sort of life any day over having a Playstation et al. This is the point you are missing. None of this is making me happy and as the years roll by I go out less and less to the point I am now scared to leave the front door. So I don't, and will spend two to three weeks at a time just stuck at home indoors terrified to go out.

Of course it wasn't always safe like it is now. For six years I got fucked by a greedy, unscrupulous landlady but that's OK I'm just a pogger so I deserved to live in a flat that constantly made me physically ill (chest infections, and no I don't smoke) and mentally ill (two overdoses). Now let me tell you why that happened.

OK, so another stupid way our country works. If I left that flat I would have made myself homeless, get to the bottom of the housing queue for you (housing that doesn't actually exist). If I went home to my mother then we would have both lost all of our benefits (because a 74 year old woman who can barely walk due to osteoporosis and arthritis can look after me) and she would have lost hers because a 45 year old bipolar, autistic, agoraphobic person with anti social disorders can look after her). So, I ended up trapped there. Leave? I'm fucked. Go to my mother's? fucked also and so would she be (because they would also up her council tax and etc).

So, apparently the process is I have to wait there to be evicted onto the street by bailiffs. Then I go to the housing place and tell them I am homeless and show them the section 21. Then they put me in a B&B, then a hostel, then eventually I would be housed in a council flat. All of that bother and expense. Stupid, isn't it? so I was forced to sit there and wait for eviction. Thankfully the trust came along and I am now homed safely and securely. Without all of the stresses of privately renting.

As for whether I work? you think I am happy about that also? it wasn't me who decided, mate. They spoke to my psych who said I could have outbursts and temper tantrums and smash things up (in meltdown) and told me that basically they would not find me employment because I was a liability (which I understand in fairness) and thus was told to claim ESA.

As I explained before, it's silly to assume you know anything much at all about my situation. Am I happy not working? no, no not really. Who fucking knows, had I been given therapy and real support maybe I could hold down a job though I doubt that as I never managed it before for long.

I also know from my dad dying when I was 7 that nothing can make you happy if you are not. No money, no playstations etc.

I had made amazing progress under my old psychiatrist. He retired, new one really doesn't give a shit. So more pills etc. Which has now led to my health being awful. For three years I have been fighting pre diabetes and a decent blood sugar level, as well as lugging around 5 stone I did not carry before and all of the side effects. Like peeing yourself and etc.

All of that rather than actually helping me. Now? now I am in withdrawal from two extremely addictive substances that our govt hand out like bloody sweets.

Trust me, I would swap places with you tomorrow.

To add to that. Nobody would rent to me because they are allowed to do that. "No DSS". Have a look for flats in your area and see how many say that.

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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Wed Sep 04, 2019 15:55 
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JohnCoffey wrote:
Me? I didn't bother. Why? because I learned from a pretty young age all about "Giant Douche VS Turd Sandwich" and you were going to get fucked no matter what.
That's not true, you tried to vote for leave:

JohnCoffey wrote:
I woke up bright and early on the 23rd. All ready to vote out. I walked to my nearest Polling station all ready to vote out but it seems somewhere they fucked up and I wasn't allowed to cast my vote there I had to go to one 3.5 miles away.

So neither Mrs JC or I could vote.


JohnCoffey wrote:
a flat that constantly made me physically ill (chest infections, and no I don't smoke)

There are frequently vape pens in your photos, see for example this one.


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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Wed Sep 04, 2019 15:59 
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Curiosity wrote:
No, JC, loads of people have put forward very compelling arguments for remaining in the EU, that are not based on “I’m alright Jack” but on the facts.

But the Leave side don’t really seem to care about them, or be able to point to exactly what will be better if we leave with no deal.

Your main argument seems to be that you hate disaster capitalism (which for some reason you call ‘liberal’) and have decided that the best way to frustrate these disaster capitalists is to...

...

... give them exactly what they want.

It just doesn’t seem a sound strategy.


The last line sums it up perfectly for me. Maybe someone should have said it to Davey Boy before he called for a vote?

The reasons you speak of were obviously not laid out because he didn't have a clue. Just like the succession of true idiots that have followed in his wake. He should be arrested.

I hinted to the fact when it happened all that time ago that many would have voted out because they were jaded at our political system. I mean fuck, look what that evil elf achieved in his term (Blair, someone else who should be arrested)

We could do with some sort of price to pay for that, but of course they are all above the law.

Look man, there are a lot of things I would totally agree with you on. I'm not a massively unreasonable person. I'm very laid back and liberal (in the real sense, not how the world pretends to be) but the fact is no-one had a fucking clue what they were really voting for. Not even the remainers.

Doc - vaping has never caused me any problems and I've been doing it for 7 years. It was only when I was at home in the flat that I got sick.

I spent three months of last year paying the govt funded rent as well as all of the utilities and standing orders on bills whilst sofa surfing with family because it was uninhabitable. Environmental Services have since slapped a prohibition order on it and it's still sitting empty. Funnily enough I spoke to my old neighbour last night.

Apparently the roof is a cause of most of the damp so she's trying to get them to spend 16 grand so she can get the order lifted and sell it, but it's all very complicated because it's a shared freehold.

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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Wed Sep 04, 2019 16:02 
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Doctor Glyndwr wrote:
JohnCoffey wrote:
Me? I didn't bother. Why? because I learned from a pretty young age all about "Giant Douche VS Turd Sandwich" and you were going to get fucked no matter what.
That's not true, you tried to vote for leave:

JohnCoffey wrote:
I woke up bright and early on the 23rd. All ready to vote out. I walked to my nearest Polling station all ready to vote out but it seems somewhere they fucked up and I wasn't allowed to cast my vote there I had to go to one 3.5 miles away.

So neither Mrs JC or I could vote.


JohnCoffey wrote:
a flat that constantly made me physically ill (chest infections, and no I don't smoke)

There are frequently vape pens in your photos, see for example this one.


Didn't see the rest, was on phone.

I could have gone into Bognor and voted. I couldn't be assed. At that time I would have voted leave just to piss off Cameron (as I pointed out then) but only because it was 200ft from our front door (which quite ironically points out how clear the leave/stay thing was). Stupidly though that wasn't where I was supposed to be voting so we CBA.

I've not voted for anything since, and the last time I voted was the first year I was legally able to do so so it was a bit of a buzz. Soon died off.

I strongly suspect it was this stuff all around the flat that was making me ill, as I've not been sick once since.

Image

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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Wed Sep 04, 2019 16:33 
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Does vaping give you chest infections then? I can’t say I’ve heard of that. Is it common, like smoking?


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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Wed Sep 04, 2019 16:44 
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Satsuma wrote:
Does vaping give you chest infections then? I can’t say I’ve heard of that. Is it common, like smoking?


No it doesn't and no it's not common.

I started vaping in 2012 on some unreliable POS (ego T, IIRC) I hovered between vaping and smoking for about a year. Then as more reliable devices became available I phased out the smoking completely. Now just the smell makes me gag.

And yes, I have massively enjoyed the benefits. I have more stamina and don't get breathless any more. It was at the point where I would wake up in the morning unable to catch my breath and would sweat as I coughed and gasped for air. It was terrifying.

I started testing how long I could hold my breath in the bath and it quadrupled.

There may be downsides to vaping no one really knows but I can assure you I've not found many yet after 7 years. Anything has to be better than 40 a day.

It's totally night and day. Until of course the EU got involved and made it all fucking awkward and annoying. I didn't say that deliberately, btw, it's just how it went.

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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Wed Sep 04, 2019 17:01 
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If I was a mod here I'd be locking this thread.

JC - this thread is not a good place for you to be - I know you have your reasons for posting things here but this is very charged / difficult for a lot of people and your not going to get the answers / understanding you need

For the others on here - I know this is tough for everyone - especially those who need medication (Nik) that may just not be around because of dumb reasons but taking this out on JC will not help.


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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Wed Sep 04, 2019 17:18 
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zaphod79 wrote:
If I was a mod here I'd be locking this thread.

JC - this thread is not a good place for you to be - I know you have your reasons for posting things here but this is very charged / difficult for a lot of people and your not going to get the answers / understanding you need

For the others on here - I know this is tough for everyone - especially those who need medication (Nik) that may just not be around because of dumb reasons but taking this out on JC will not help.


I'm fine with it really man.

There are probably a lot of reasons why I'd want to stay in the EU and why I would also want to leave. Like I said, you can't have it all.

It's literally that no one really understands. Sure, there are reasons being put forward by both sides and they all have a point, but they're being used angrily mostly to scare and or threaten the other side. It's all a part of the liberal passive aggressive I was talking about earlier. So long as you smile politely you can bend someone over and fuck them but that's ok you did it with a smile. Just like all of these new laws they keep bringing in to silence people.

How do I feel? Like many others I'd assume. We should fuck all of these cunts off and basically let the world be ran by scientists and doctors. Not businessmen and women who do everything to suit themselves.

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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Wed Sep 04, 2019 17:30 
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The reason that those on the Remain side get angry when talking about provable facts with the Leave side is simply because those on the Leave side will not listen.

There has been plenty of information about just how fucked the country will be if we crash out with no-deal, including information from our own government, but the Leavers I've come across literally couldn't care less. They brush it off with phrases like "we voted out, so get on with it".

If someone isn't willing to listen to reasoned argument, then what else can you do? This is why people get angry.

(and there are also problems like this on the Remain side too, although I'm yet to see anyone provide one single credible* benefit for leaving the EU at all, let alone crashing out with no-deal)

* By credible I mean "stands up to scrutiny", i.e. it can't be easily disproved with a cursory fact check.

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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Wed Sep 04, 2019 17:37 
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Right. Sorry. Bye.


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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Wed Sep 04, 2019 17:40 
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It's exactly the same on both sides dude. Has been right from the start. Other than my wish to give Cameron a shock I've hardly gotten involved. I just read the shit being slung from both sides. It's kinda like watching a great game of football where loads of goals go in but it's cool because you don't support either team. That's how Brexit feels to me. I'm neutral because I already know that either way I'm fucked.

However, just because someone is neutral and or leave or remain doesn't make them stupid or racist. It all depends on how your life is and how, if at all, it affects you.

My mother voted leave. That doesn't mean she's stupid or racist. It just means from the very low amount of information given that is what she decided. She did, after all, grow up in a Britain that lived before the EU.

The EU that btw we entered with no vote and no choice.

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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Wed Sep 04, 2019 17:45 
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Gogmagog

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JohnCoffey wrote:
The EU that btw we entered with no vote and no choice.


This isn't true. There was a referendum

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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Wed Sep 04, 2019 17:46 
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Gogmagog

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JohnCoffey wrote:
MaliA wrote:
Didn't you used to have a job in the US, JC?


Yeah I did.


Then what's the difference?

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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Wed Sep 04, 2019 17:50 
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zaphod79 wrote:
JC - this thread is not a good place for you to be - I know you have your reasons for posting things here but this is very charged / difficult for a lot of people and your not going to get the answers / understanding you need

For the others on here - I know this is tough for everyone - especially those who need medication (Nik) that may just not be around because of dumb reasons but taking this out on JC will not help.


:this:

Honestly JC, step away from the thread, there's nothing good for you here.

It's always so edifying to see the quarterly JC pile-on get back into full swing, we should put in the BEEX calendar.

IMPORTANT REMINDER, TO BE ENACTED EVERY THREE MONTHS - BEAT UP ON THE DISABLED GUY.

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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Wed Sep 04, 2019 18:00 
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Esoteric

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MaliA wrote:
JohnCoffey wrote:
MaliA wrote:
Didn't you used to have a job in the US, JC?


Yeah I did.


Then what's the difference?


What between then and now? A lot dude.

At my last job in the USA I assaulted one of the managers. He talked to me like shit, I took it for as long as I could and I snapped. It didn't just all happen overnight. I've had serious problems since I was born. Early signs were there and my mother did raise it with my father but my father was a bricklayer so you can imagine the sensitivity he had. Don't get me wrong he was a wonderful father but accept something was amiss with his kid? No. This was the 70s. He wouldn't even accept that his mother was bipolar and had to be sectioned numerous times. He just left my mother to deal with it.

He died, my mother continually sought help but when assessed they would simply say I was angry etc and it was all down to my father dying. The last time I saw a shrink before I got married was when I was 13 and I went into a strop and smashed up his paperweight. It wasn't the thing to do then, it carried an enormous stigma no one wanted.

I got into drugs when I was 13, mostly to stop me cutting myself etc. I did that until 21, had about three jobs none lasted more than a couple of months.

Started getting into computers in the early 90s. Learned quick. Met first wife, got a job at computer shop and was doing ok. Had bad anger problems but yeah. Went to USA. Didn't work for 6 years because of green card issues. Bipolar was starting to manifest very strongly so first wife makes me go to psych. Get diagnosed bipolar 2. Go on meds.

Eventually I became very ill. Wife left, lost health insurance lost meds went around the bend. When I got home in 2008 I was very ill. Seeing things, hearing things. Immediately get help, been there ever since.

It's always been there. Long before my dad died.

I can tell you that when you hit 40 life becomes almost unbearable. It's a lot easier when you can go without sleep for three days and not start becoming delusional.

It didn't just happen overnight dude. Like I said I was monitored very closely. Especially when I got ran over and spent 3 months in hospital. They'd just keep saying the same thing, it's because his father died. Yet my brother is very successful and has exhibited none of the symptoms or problems.

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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Wed Sep 04, 2019 18:05 
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Esoteric

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Hearthly wrote:
zaphod79 wrote:
JC - this thread is not a good place for you to be - I know you have your reasons for posting things here but this is very charged / difficult for a lot of people and your not going to get the answers / understanding you need

For the others on here - I know this is tough for everyone - especially those who need medication (Nik) that may just not be around because of dumb reasons but taking this out on JC will not help.


:this:

Honestly JC, step away from the thread, there's nothing good for you here.

It's always so edifying to see the quarterly JC pile-on get back into full swing, we should put in the BEEX calendar.

IMPORTANT REMINDER, TO BE ENACTED EVERY THREE MONTHS - BEAT UP ON THE DISABLED GUY.



I can totally understand why people are angry. I really can. Believe me, nobody here is as fucking pissed off at this shower of shit than I.

I knew tensions would be high, but I can't have people saying people are stupid just because they have different views.

As for me personally? Like I've said in the past when all you really look forward to is dying then talking about it on a forum pales into nothingness.

For that you'd have to care, and I'm long past that. Yeah so I'm ill. This was the mistake both my ex wife and landlady made by assuming I was also stupid.

Landlady has already lost the deposit dispute, now she faces court. Funny how much I know about housing laws now really.

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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Wed Sep 04, 2019 18:36 
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Can't re-member

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Grim... wrote:
JohnCoffey wrote:
In the area I live it's destroyed the working class. Mostly because allowing in anyone from the EU allows the greedy to have access to cheap labour. That's great for businesses but not so great for people just needing a job.

Well, the job's still there. It just didn't go to an English person.

Shit son, are you saying not all working class people are white English? Mind blown

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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Wed Sep 04, 2019 18:43 
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Esoteric

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I don't recall putting any labels on the working class.

English, British it's all the same. It doesn't automatically mean white. I never said it did, either.

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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Wed Sep 04, 2019 18:47 
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Christ, a lot of tedious stuff has happened in this thread. I’m sorry I couldn’t be a part of it

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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Wed Sep 04, 2019 18:47 
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Mr Chonks wrote:
Christ, a lot of tedious stuff has happened in this thread. I’m sorry I couldn’t be a part of it

You were here in spirit.

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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Wed Sep 04, 2019 22:25 
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Fitness Nut...

Joined: 25th Sep, 2008
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Hearthly wrote:
zaphod79 wrote:
JC - this thread is not a good place for you to be - I know you have your reasons for posting things here but this is very charged / difficult for a lot of people and your not going to get the answers / understanding you need

For the others on here - I know this is tough for everyone - especially those who need medication (Nik) that may just not be around because of dumb reasons but taking this out on JC will not help.


:this:

Honestly JC, step away from the thread, there's nothing good for you here.

It's always so edifying to see the quarterly JC pile-on get back into full swing, we should put in the BEEX calendar.

IMPORTANT REMINDER, TO BE ENACTED EVERY THREE MONTHS - BEAT UP ON THE DISABLED GUY.


Oh come on. You know better than that

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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Wed Sep 04, 2019 22:36 
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Two heads are better than one

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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Wed Sep 04, 2019 22:46 
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Sleepyhead

Joined: 30th Mar, 2008
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MaliA wrote:
JohnCoffey wrote:
The EU that btw we entered with no vote and no choice.


This isn't true. There was a referendum


This is the problem, you see. JC doesn’t have a sodding clue what he’s talking about, and any actual attempt to elicit facts is met with “Oh, both sides are the same”, and then an anecdote that is either factually incorrect or has nothing to do with the EU.

And if you don’t know much about something then fair enough; nobody has to be an expert at everything. But if you have a group of people who have read up a lot on a subject, such as people here on the EU, then don’t come stamping on through in your Size Twelves telling them that they don’t understand it.

It’d be like me going over to the PC thread and saying I know more about the builds and performance times than the rest of you (or me posting in most threads tbf).

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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Thu Sep 05, 2019 8:04 
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He's an autistic guy working himself up into a hell of a state, the sensible thing to do is stop prodding, step back, and let the situation cool down of its own accord.

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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Thu Sep 05, 2019 8:17 
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Gogmagog

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I agree with Curio

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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Thu Sep 05, 2019 8:27 
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Fitness Nut...

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Hearthly wrote:
He's an autistic guy working himself up into a hell of a state, the sensible thing to do is stop prodding, step back, and let the situation cool down of its own accord.


Or he just stops posting. Not a difficult one to do is it?

Also it is rather rude to say they are picking on the 'disabled guy'. It is implying the group are bullies. That is not fair and you know that.

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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Thu Sep 05, 2019 8:45 
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Worth remembering that one person doesn't have the monopoly of autism (and resultant meltdowns), illness or disability, or indeed feeling picked on.

But I apologise if I've piled on to anyone, and for being tedious.

Anyway, Parliament's been dead good this week, hasn't it? :)


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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Thu Sep 05, 2019 8:47 
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KovacsC wrote:
Hearthly wrote:
He's an autistic guy working himself up into a hell of a state, the sensible thing to do is stop prodding, step back, and let the situation cool down of its own accord.


Or he just stops posting. Not a difficult one to do is it?

You say that... I told myself not to return to this thread. I held fast for a good few hours, but I've blown it this morning - nagging sense of indignant righteousness became too much to ignore! :D

Group hug?


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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Thu Sep 05, 2019 8:48 
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Nik wrote:
Anyway, Parliament's been dead good this week, hasn't it? :)


Yes. The change of cast has given the writers a new lease of life, particuarly as they move to wrap up a number of long running threads.

Seriously, I'm glad I switched over last night in time to see Jess Phillips' performance. Pure passion.


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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Thu Sep 05, 2019 8:49 
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Meanwhile, in the USA, Donald Trump draws on a map to win an argument with meteorologists.


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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Thu Sep 05, 2019 8:50 
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I bloody love Jess Phillips. I would be delighted to see her as PM. She's in it to make people's lives better - polar opposite of Johnson.


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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Thu Sep 05, 2019 8:57 
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Gogmagog

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Jess Phillips is brilliant

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