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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Wed May 03, 2017 11:34 
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MaliA wrote:
Another example: Corbyn turned down doing debates. May wasn't going to be there. Amazing chance on national TV to begin each answer with "I'd thank the prime minister for her thoughts on tbis, but she isn't here" or somesuch, and get a superb platform to build from. The rewards outweigh the risk massively, but he isn't taking it.


Agree. Giving up free airtime is stupid. His supporters keep on saying that the media misrepresent him, but here's a chance to have complete access to the broadcasters and control the agenda, and he declined. Yes, the other parties might start turning on him, but he could use that to his advantage. But no, better to stay away and have the real fight on the streets.


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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Wed May 03, 2017 11:35 
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MaliA wrote:
Kern wrote:
MaliA wrote:
It's where they keep going wrong. They aren't getting the (any) message across.


This. What are Labour standing for? What's the message? Yes, Mrs May's Dalek-like repetition of 'strong and stable' is annoying, but it works in staying your head. Labour? What do they want?


Rudd did this very well, yesterday.


I liked the one on the ever-brilliant Doaneld the Unready twitter feed. Something along the lines of 'Strong and stable - how Catherine the Great likes her lovers'.

EDIT: ah, here it is


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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Wed May 03, 2017 11:36 
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Kern wrote:
If you like grasping at straws, and I do (it's the only way to keep sane some days), I remember around 2004/2005 reading many articles and books about the death of the Tory party and the unbeatableness of New Labourism. 15 years earlier those books would have been about Labour. The wheel will turn eventually.

I suppose thinking about it sensibly once it becomes apparent that Brexit is going to completely wreck the economy then the EU will again become the massive problem for the Tories that it always was. It seems conceivable they'll become even more divided than ever before.

But of course that is going to be some small crumb of comfort because by then the whole country and everything in it will be so fucked that whoever is in charge and however competent they are they'll be able to deliver nothing anyway. Yay!


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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Wed May 03, 2017 11:36 
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Things can only get better.


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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Wed May 03, 2017 11:59 
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MaliA wrote:
It's where they keep going wrong. They aren't getting the (any) message across. In 2015, they didn't stand up to the "Labour smashed the economy" claims, well enough (if) at all, the referendum campaign was far too low key, and, now, the message is Abbott's interview. There doesn't seem to be an effictive comms policy.

I think I've made that point, like, twice now.

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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Wed May 03, 2017 12:02 
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MrChris wrote:
MaliA wrote:
It's where they keep going wrong. They aren't getting the (any) message across. In 2015, they didn't stand up to the "Labour smashed the economy" claims, well enough (if) at all, the referendum campaign was far too low key, and, now, the message is Abbott's interview. There doesn't seem to be an effictive comms policy.

I think I've made that point, like, twice now.


Yes, but I have better hair.

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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Thu May 04, 2017 8:18 
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County Council election time. Did the votey thing. Third in line this time. Getting better.

North-east Oxfordshire, this morning:
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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Thu May 04, 2017 11:58 
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So what is a rubber button?


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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Thu May 04, 2017 11:59 
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GazChap wrote:
So what is a rubber button?


Jeremy Corbyn does up his anorak with them.


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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Thu May 04, 2017 12:51 
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Gogmagog

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Lolz

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/li ... itics-live


Quote:
The Labour party may have selected a record number of female candidates (41%) to fight June’s general election, but not in Shipley, where the Women’s Equality party is trying to unseat the divisive Tory incumbent, Philip Davies.

Female Labour party members in the West Yorkshire seat are threatening to vote for Walker after Labour decided to field the same man who lost last time to the divisive Tory incumbent, Philip Davies.

The split in the local party opened up on Wednesday when Labour’s national executive committee (NEC) chose Steve Clapcote, a lecturer at Leeds University, to fight Davies, who beat him by 9,624 votes in 2015, winning 50% of the ballot.

A number of members have written to the local constituency Labour party (CLP) suggesting Labour form a progressive alliance to stop Davies. They want the party to join the Greens and step back to help Sophie Waker, the leader of the Women’s Equality party (WEP), who announced ten days ago that she would be contesting the seat.

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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Thu May 04, 2017 15:04 
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Kern wrote:
MaliA wrote:
Another example: Corbyn turned down doing debates. May wasn't going to be there. Amazing chance on national TV to begin each answer with "I'd thank the prime minister for her thoughts on tbis, but she isn't here" or somesuch, and get a superb platform to build from. The rewards outweigh the risk massively, but he isn't taking it.


Agree. Giving up free airtime is stupid. His supporters keep on saying that the media misrepresent him, but here's a chance to have complete access to the broadcasters and control the agenda, and he declined. Yes, the other parties might start turning on him, but he could use that to his advantage. But no, better to stay away and have the real fight on the streets.


https://www.buzzfeed.com/jimwaterson/je ... .qqQQqYDD8

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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Thu May 04, 2017 15:23 
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MaliA wrote:
https://www.buzzfeed.com/jimwaterson/jeremy-corbyn-has-ditched-newspaper-journalists-on-the?utm_term=.giZB69kkA#.qqQQqYDD8


That's not actually completely stupid, under the circumstances. However, on the debate thing, he's 100% in the wrong.

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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Thu May 04, 2017 16:41 
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Kern wrote:
MaliA wrote:
Another example: Corbyn turned down doing debates. May wasn't going to be there. Amazing chance on national TV to begin each answer with "I'd thank the prime minister for her thoughts on tbis, but she isn't here" or somesuch, and get a superb platform to build from. The rewards outweigh the risk massively, but he isn't taking it.


Agree. Giving up free airtime is stupid. His supporters keep on saying that the media misrepresent him, but here's a chance to have complete access to the broadcasters and control the agenda, and he declined. Yes, the other parties might start turning on him, but he could use that to his advantage. But no, better to stay away and have the real fight on the streets.


I think they were scared on this. Miliband did similar when Cameron chickened out, and the other parties decided it would be best to just trash Ed rather than the incumbent government (though they also laid into Mr Clegg). It's generally considered to have been a Bad Thing for Labour. As such, they have shied away this time for fear that all the others invited take turns to bash the fuck out of Corbyn.

In a close election (like last time), staying away might be sensible.

At the moment it's gearing up to be a fucking rout, so what do they have to lose? Go out there and just passionately appeal on the populist policies. Get the message across and try to show people why they should vote for you! It's not damage limitation when you're damaged beyond the bounds of sanity already.

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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Thu May 04, 2017 18:16 
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I've found the distribution of signs round here to be most interesting.

As in all the signs people are putting up seem to be LD signs.


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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Fri May 05, 2017 7:18 
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Jesus Christ, just look at the results. I'm sure Corbyn's acolytes will spin this as some sort of victory though.

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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Fri May 05, 2017 7:23 
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INFINITE POWAH

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Oh, it's "unique circumstances". Perhaps those unique circumstances are a combination of the worst leader and worst shadow front bench in living memory?

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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Fri May 05, 2017 8:24 
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MrChris wrote:
Oh, it's "unique circumstances".


Getting out to vote and holding office is only playing the Establishment's game.


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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Fri May 05, 2017 9:07 
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MrChris wrote:
Oh, it's "unique circumstances". Perhaps those unique circumstances are a combination of the worst leader and worst shadow front bench in living memory?


Democracy is biased against Corbyn.

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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Fri May 05, 2017 9:20 
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This morning I saw a photo of Mr Trump and Republican congressmen celebrating taking healthcare away from people in the US and it quite put me off my breakfast. Domestic politics in another country shouldn't bother me so much, but this one does because it's so dam brazen.


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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Fri May 05, 2017 9:50 
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The world is disgusting at the moment.

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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Fri May 05, 2017 9:53 
8-Bit Champion
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Kern wrote:
This morning I saw a photo of Mr Trump and Republican congressmen celebrating taking healthcare away from people in the US and it quite put me off my breakfast. Domestic politics in another country shouldn't bother me so much, but this one does because it's so dam brazen.


My real problem is I could see the exact same thing happening here - you read about this and think 'why would anyone vote for it' and realize they are doing it because they will make themselves more money

https://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/pl ... ba787222bd

So basically take lots of money that the government is using for healthcare and instead give the top earners in the country a tax break.


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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Fri May 05, 2017 9:53 
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Is this really where we are now? It feels like everything that's happened since 9/11 has been a slow, inexorable slide to the right. Politics of fear is actually fucking winning.

Also, you rarely see a Tory celebration picture with lots of young happy people in it, do? Just a lot of middle aged and elderly, clutching their fucking handbags away from the FORRINS and the TERRORIZTS!

Fuck this, I'm moving to the moon.


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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Fri May 05, 2017 9:54 
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But hey, at least UKIP is disappearing.

Silver linings...


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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Fri May 05, 2017 9:58 
8-Bit Champion
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DavPaz wrote:
But hey, at least UKIP is disappearing.

Silver linings...


UKIP is disappearing because all the people that agreed with their policies and the way there were going about things see that the conservative party is doing exactly what they want to do so are voting for them.

To me that's not a silver lining :-(

(I took something you were happy about and made it bad and I'm sorry for that)


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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Fri May 05, 2017 9:59 
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Bah!

Moon it is, then!


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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Fri May 05, 2017 10:02 
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Early indications suggest the turnout for the Merseyside Metro Mayoral election may be as low as 25%


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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Fri May 05, 2017 10:20 
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Kern wrote:
This morning I saw a photo of Mr Trump and Republican congressmen celebrating taking healthcare away from people in the US and it quite put me off my breakfast. Domestic politics in another country shouldn't bother me so much, but this one does because it's so dam brazen.

:this: :(

It prompted me to write a short essay on twitter, describing my feelings about said Republicans (tl;dr - it's not very complimentary).


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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Fri May 05, 2017 10:24 
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Nik wrote:
It prompted me to write a short essay on twitter, describing my feelings about said Republicans .


:DD


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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Fri May 05, 2017 10:28 
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Kern, when are you going to run? We need someone sensible in charge.

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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Fri May 05, 2017 10:39 
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Jesus. These local results are depressing. Cuntservatives are going to get in again.

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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Fri May 05, 2017 10:41 
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The Republican shit in the States is beyond vile. It will, by their own admissions, kill more Americans than Al Qaeda and ISIS have ever done, and they're celebrating it. Just horrible.

Not to mention that it appears to make being assaulted or raped a pre-existing condition. Which seems terribly odd and horrible. So women who don't want to lose their health insurance shouldn't report their rape. I wonder which party full of fucking rapists put that through Congress.

Silver lining is that the Senate is crazy, but less crazy than the House. Hopefully it never gets passed.

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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Fri May 05, 2017 11:08 
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Curiosity wrote:
So women who don't want to lose their health insurance shouldn't report their rape.


Indeed, bit of a rapists' charter, given they'll know their victims will likely not report it.

https://twitter.com/KillerMartinis/stat ... 2404979712




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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Fri May 05, 2017 11:10 
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Zardoz wrote:
Jesus. These local results are depressing.


Turnout here in the Shire is 33%. I wish more people would take an interest in local politics: yes, they lack the budget or powers they ought to have but the decisions they do make still matter. I'll get off my high horse now. :)


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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Fri May 05, 2017 11:24 
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I voted in the evening and was dismayed to see a lack of ruled lines next to names as they looked for mine on the print outs.

PEOPLE. START GIVING A FUCK please.

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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Fri May 05, 2017 11:25 
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Zardoz wrote:
I voted in the evening and was dismayed to see a lack of ruled lines next to names as they looked for mine on the print outs.

PEOPLE. START GIVING A FUCK please.


This^^^


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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Fri May 05, 2017 11:55 
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Curiosity wrote:
Not to mention that it appears to make being assaulted or raped a pre-existing condition. Which seems terribly odd and horrible. So women who don't want to lose their health insurance shouldn't report their rape. I wonder which party full of fucking rapists put that through Congress.

Have you got a source for this? Even the most ardent anti republican news sources I read haven't breathed a word about this.


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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Fri May 05, 2017 12:02 
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Mr Dave wrote:
Curiosity wrote:
Not to mention that it appears to make being assaulted or raped a pre-existing condition. Which seems terribly odd and horrible. So women who don't want to lose their health insurance shouldn't report their rape. I wonder which party full of fucking rapists put that through Congress.

Have you got a source for this? Even the most ardent anti republican news sources I read haven't breathed a word about this.


http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world ... 18661.html


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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Fri May 05, 2017 13:02 
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It also makes it a precondition to have had a C-section or be a victim of domestic violence

https://qz.com/975894/under-the-republi ... onditions/

Quote:
C-sections, since they can lead to future health complications, for instance leading to the development of conditions such as placenta accreta in future pregnancies, or making future deliveries through C-sections far more likely, exposing the mother to higher risks of hemorrhage and post-surgery complications.

Sexual assault, as it can put people at a higher risk for mental-health issues and substance abuse. (In some instances in the past—like the case of Christina Turner, in Texas, before Obamacare was implemented—getting prescribed medication like HIV retroviral drugs after a rape has compromised women’s ability to secure coverage.)

Domestic violence, since it can lead to a higher need for mental and physical health care.



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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Fri May 05, 2017 13:35 
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Jesus Christ!

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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Fri May 05, 2017 14:00 
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Nik wrote:
Mr Dave wrote:
Curiosity wrote:
Not to mention that it appears to make being assaulted or raped a pre-existing condition. Which seems terribly odd and horrible. So women who don't want to lose their health insurance shouldn't report their rape. I wonder which party full of fucking rapists put that through Congress.

Have you got a source for this? Even the most ardent anti republican news sources I read haven't breathed a word about this.


http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world ... 18661.html

Thank you, Sir.


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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Fri May 05, 2017 14:55 
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INFINITE POWAH

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Grim... wrote:
Jesus Christ!

Amen.

That's... well, words sort of fail me, but "appalling" will do for now.

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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Fri May 05, 2017 14:59 
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The hope is that they've given themselves lots of rope to hang themselves with by passing a bill that apparently stands little chance of passing the senate.

But that does rely on an informed public...


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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Fri May 05, 2017 15:18 
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Results for the Shire are in. Tories remain one short of a majority, but a number of seats flipped. The two Green ones went to Labour, and we've got a new party represented: the Henley Residents' Group.


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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Fri May 05, 2017 15:25 
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Fucking hell, as well as putting the Tories in the absolute fucking morons round here have given UKIP their only council seat so far.


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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Fri May 05, 2017 15:29 
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Aaaaaaaaaand Tees Valley have voted for the Tory.

At least it was close.


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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Fri May 05, 2017 15:38 
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Gogmagog

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MrChris wrote:
Curiosity wrote:
God I hate the role of the media in politics.

What's it done now? The reporting on Abbott's utter incompetence is fair isn't it?

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/vi ... sses-video

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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Fri May 05, 2017 15:41 
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Gogmagog

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DavPaz wrote:
Aaaaaaaaaand Tees Valley have voted for the Tory.

At least it was close.


You'll get your airport back.

http://www.darlingtonandstocktontimes.c ... f=mrb&lp=1

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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Fri May 05, 2017 15:46 
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DavPaz wrote:
Aaaaaaaaaand Tees Valley have voted for the Tory.


I voted for a Tory. As dirty as it makes me feel being generally anti-Tory at every level, the Tory candidate was the best for the job locally. He has lived here all his life and already achieved tons for the town in his position as mayor and alongside the town council which IMO for local council positions is more important than party politics.

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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Fri May 05, 2017 15:52 
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That's cool, people are of course free to vote however they feel, but Tees valley turning blue makes me sick. Short, short memories.


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 Post subject: Re: Political Banter and Debate Thread
PostPosted: Fri May 05, 2017 15:54 
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Unpossible!

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MaliA wrote:
DavPaz wrote:
Aaaaaaaaaand Tees Valley have voted for the Tory.

At least it was close.


You'll get your airport back.

http://www.darlingtonandstocktontimes.c ... f=mrb&lp=1

Waste of money. Teesside Airport was always a shed in meadow, and wasting money on trying to resurrect it is folly.


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