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 Post subject: Re: Gas Guzzling Money Pits
PostPosted: Fri Nov 17, 2017 16:59 
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Zardoz wrote:
Your cars all crank start with flags for indicators, Cavey?

Ludite!


:D

I am an unashamed Luddite, far from denying it, I embrace it. :)
The GT4 is the last of the old school, back to basics racers - no turbo, manual gearbox, rear wheel drive, hard to drive fast - you have to work for every mph and those semi-slick Cup tyres bite back hard like you wouldn't believe - but that's all part of the fun! When you buy a game, do you change all the settings to super-easy?

Look, a rip-snorting 8,000 RPM deafening, wailing shriek from a thoroughbred 4-litre racing six pot used in pure anger is something I want to directly experience for as long as I can. I ain't getting that from DC motors.

People can disagree/hate all the want but that's how I roll, and I am not going to change. Ever. :)

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 Post subject: Re: Gas Guzzling Money Pits
PostPosted: Fri Nov 17, 2017 17:07 
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You don't need to tell me about raw power, I've a 14 year old Mk1 Leon.

I'm just a forward thinking maverick, willing to consider anything that might give me the edge on those mean streets.

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 Post subject: Re: Gas Guzzling Money Pits
PostPosted: Fri Nov 17, 2017 17:13 
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Cavey wrote:
"Off the charts fast" [er, up to 120mph limit]

No, 250.

Cavey wrote:
for 50 miles, then you're fucked for 4-8 hours whilst the trickle charger does its 'magic'. Hope you don't have to go anywhere far, then.

Like I said, I've got a Focus for that.

Cavey wrote:
190mph and 4 secs to 60 is quite "off the charts" enough for me

Dear Christ, what is it, a tractor? :D

Cavey wrote:
and I get to enjoy the handling, the sense of occasion, the wonderful noise, the motorsport heritage.

Can't comment on the handling of the Tesla yet, but if that's what you're after you'll get far more of those things in a Caterham.

Cavey wrote:
The GT4 is the last of the old school, back to basics racers

That's utter, utter bullshit. It's a lovely car, but it's not that. It's got traction and stab control, abs, electric power steering, and a roof! It's got less gubbins than a Nissan GT for sure, but to suggest it's "back to basics" or the "last" of them is flat-out wrong.

Disclaimer: I may not be remembering exactly what type of car you have, so the above might be wrong.

Cavey wrote:
When you buy a game, do you change all the settings to super-easy?

When you buy a saw, do you use it to dice your food? If you want a really, really fast car it can be different from the car you want to do 500 miles in. And it's nothing to do with the environment (for me, at least) - it's all about a really nice, really fast car.

Anything that can punch me down a 1/4 mile in less than nine seconds is going to get some serious Grim...loving. Especially if it'll come and fetch me when it's raining.

Dismissing it out of hand because of the drive system is as alien to me as dismissing it because of the colour.

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 Post subject: Re: Gas Guzzling Money Pits
PostPosted: Fri Nov 17, 2017 17:21 
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Heh. :)
I suppose the other dimension (besides BS claims about real world performance of EVs, or indeed their real 'environmental credentials') is that, in any case, it's not simply a case of being the fastest guy to 60mph [or whatever other bragging rights stat, insert here].

If I wanted to be the fastest guy on the road, I would've spent a lot less money and bought a considerably faster Nissan GT-R. But it's not just about outright, measurable performance (or more accurately, merely one aspect of measurable performance), any more than the best meal is according to how big it is. There are a whole gamut of both objective and subjective considerations and parameters which vary from one individual to the next, and to be an enthusiast (pertrolhead if you will) is to care deeply about many of these, including quite a few intangibles, such is the human condition.

There may come a time where EVs evolve to be far more nuanced, subtle and diversified, complete with their own gamut of machine-human interactions in the same way that ICE cars and motorcycles have evolved for the last century, but somehow I doubt it: an electric motor simply does not have the potential to vary widely, as compared to an internal combustion engine, and in any event it is clear that human interaction is far from the intended goal medium - to long term. Cars of the future won't even be owned at all; we'll simply Uber a permanently roaming cloud of EVs for hire at each journey requirement, and we won't be "driving" anywhere, any more than we do in a train. To some people this is great, and road accidents will be a fraction of what they are now, but to someone like me, this is Dystopia.

Or then again, maybe I being too melodramatic, it's been a long week.

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 Post subject: Re: Gas Guzzling Money Pits
PostPosted: Fri Nov 17, 2017 17:22 
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Grim... wrote:
When you buy a saw, do you use it to dice your food?

:D

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 Post subject: Re: Gas Guzzling Money Pits
PostPosted: Fri Nov 17, 2017 17:29 
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Grim... wrote:
That's utter, utter bullshit. It's a lovely car, but it's not that. It's got traction and stab control, abs, electric power steering, and a roof! It's got less gubbins than a Nissan GT for sure, but to suggest it's "back to basics" or the "last" of them is flat-out wrong.


It's got *a lot* less gubbins than most cars, especially in its performance bracket. How many small cars that do 190mph, on sale today, can you think of that are not 4wd and don't have flappy paddles? How many of them come with semi-slicks as standard, and have *manually* adjustable suspension that you have to get the spanners out for? How many of them have no turbo?


If you want to compare a GT4 with a Caterham or a 1960s Austin Healey or whatevs, then yeah, it's the last word in modernity, but to do so would be pretty bloody stupid and moreover, would be missing the point.

I think you'll find, then, it's all relative - and neither "utter bullshit" or "flat wrong". Those terms belong to EVs and the mugs who actually think they're in any sense "green".

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 Post subject: Re: Gas Guzzling Money Pits
PostPosted: Fri Nov 17, 2017 17:30 
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Cavey wrote:
There are a whole gamut of both objective and subjective considerations and parameters which vary from one individual to the next, and to be an enthusiast (pertrolhead if you will) is to care deeply about many of these, including quite a few intangibles, such is the human condition.

Cavester, did you... Did you just realise that different people can have different opinions without one of them being "wrong"?

Now our Caveboy truely is a Caveman!

As a reward, you can upgrade your mobility scooter to one of these:

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 Post subject: Re: Gas Guzzling Money Pits
PostPosted: Fri Nov 17, 2017 17:31 
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Cavey wrote:
Those terms belong to EVs and the mugs who actually think they're in any sense "green".

Who said that? I mean, you have, like four times, but no-one else did. Are you meant to be posting on a different forum?

I'm taking the mobility scooter away again. Now you're getting one of those ones with a roof and a flashing orange light.

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 Post subject: Re: Gas Guzzling Money Pits
PostPosted: Fri Nov 17, 2017 17:32 
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Zardoz wrote:
Grim... wrote:
When you buy a saw, do you use it to dice your food?

:D


Worst analogy ever.
If I want to go from A to B I buy a nice, comfy, economical hatch for £15k and save an absolute fortune. But I'm not buying the GT4 for personal tranport, I'm buying it for trips to the Nurburgring, Oulton and Silverstone; to go racing with my brother in his GTS; to enjoy *purely for its own sake* just driving anywhere, or even just admiring it in the garage because I love cars.

"Dice your food" :facepalm:

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 Post subject: Re: Gas Guzzling Money Pits
PostPosted: Fri Nov 17, 2017 17:36 
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Grim... wrote:
Cavey wrote:
There are a whole gamut of both objective and subjective considerations and parameters which vary from one individual to the next, and to be an enthusiast (pertrolhead if you will) is to care deeply about many of these, including quite a few intangibles, such is the human condition.

Cavester, did you... Did you just realise that different people can have different opinions without one of them being "wrong"?

Now our Caveboy truely is a Caveman!

As a reward, you can upgrade your mobility scooter to one of these:

Image


Where did I say people have to agree with me?
Where did I say they were wrong?

It's called an opinion.

I. Hate. Electric. Cars. I. Think. They. Are. Shit.

Sorry!

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 Post subject: Re: Gas Guzzling Money Pits
PostPosted: Fri Nov 17, 2017 17:39 
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Cavey wrote:
How many small cars that do 190mph, on sale today, can you think of that are not 4wd and don't have flappy paddles?

Quite a lot, to be honest. A whole slew of Mustangs, for startes. The Viper GTS-R will do over 200, and still has a six speed box. Some of the old Vantages will go that fast too and, well, so will a McLaren F1 if you've got deep pockets.

Cavey wrote:
How many of them come with semi-slicks as standard and have *manually* adjustable suspension that you have to get the spanners out for?

All suspension is adjustable if you've got your spanners out ;)

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 Post subject: Re: Gas Guzzling Money Pits
PostPosted: Fri Nov 17, 2017 17:41 
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Cavey wrote:
Zardoz wrote:
Grim... wrote:
When you buy a saw, do you use it to dice your food?

:D

Worst analogy ever.
If I want to go from A to B I buy a nice, comfy, economical hatch for £15k and save an absolute fortune. But I'm not buying the GT4 for personal tranport, I'm buying it for trips to the Nurburgring, Oulton and Silverstone; to go racing with my brother in his GTS; to enjoy *purely for its own sake* just driving anywhere, or even just admiring it in the garage because I love cars.

That was my point, man!

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 Post subject: Re: Gas Guzzling Money Pits
PostPosted: Fri Nov 17, 2017 17:44 
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Mate, the McLaren F1 is a quarter of a century old FFS, last available in the 90s, and Mustangs ain't small (and the ones you can get in the UK don't go anywhere near 190mph, and some have turbos). But yes, they are also old school (and I love 'em all, as you know, and was going to get one!)

Be honest though, most cars ain't like Mustangs or GT4s, in the specific respects that I mention.


But look, you're getting pissed off now which is :( because we're talking shit about *cars* FFS, so whatevs :shrug:
I'm off to get drunk shortly, I need it.

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 Post subject: Re: Gas Guzzling Money Pits
PostPosted: Fri Nov 17, 2017 17:47 
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Fear no, no-one my end is pissed off.

Well, actually, Carlos is, but that's because his PC isn't working.

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 Post subject: Re: Gas Guzzling Money Pits
PostPosted: Fri Nov 17, 2017 17:49 
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Cool
Cars are an emotive subject... but still only cars likes. :)

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 Post subject: Re: Gas Guzzling Money Pits
PostPosted: Fri Nov 17, 2017 17:49 
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Hi Carlos!

Cheer up buddy, soon be weekend.

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 Post subject: Re: Gas Guzzling Money Pits
PostPosted: Fri Nov 17, 2017 17:49 
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On Mustangs, I'd well rather have one of these than an original

http://revologycars.com/1967-shelby-gt500/

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 Post subject: Re: Gas Guzzling Money Pits
PostPosted: Fri Nov 17, 2017 17:50 
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I don't even think Carlos can drive.

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 Post subject: Re: Gas Guzzling Money Pits
PostPosted: Fri Nov 17, 2017 17:50 
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Cras wrote:
On Mustangs, I'd well rather have one of these than an original

http://revologycars.com/1967-shelby-gt500/


Beautiful.

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 Post subject: Re: Gas Guzzling Money Pits
PostPosted: Fri Nov 17, 2017 17:51 
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Cras wrote:
On Mustangs, I'd well rather have one of these than an original

http://revologycars.com/1967-shelby-gt500/

Oh you twat.

What am I going to do with this raging car-boner?

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 Post subject: Re: Gas Guzzling Money Pits
PostPosted: Fri Nov 17, 2017 17:52 
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Grim... wrote:
Cras wrote:
On Mustangs, I'd well rather have one of these than an original

http://revologycars.com/1967-shelby-gt500/

Oh you twat.

What am I going to do with this raging car-boner?

Get Carlos to sort it out while you fix his PC?

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 Post subject: Re: Gas Guzzling Money Pits
PostPosted: Fri Nov 17, 2017 17:52 
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Right? Fucking incredible thing.

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 Post subject: Re: Gas Guzzling Money Pits
PostPosted: Fri Nov 17, 2017 17:53 
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"car-boner"

:DD

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 Post subject: Re: Gas Guzzling Money Pits
PostPosted: Fri Nov 17, 2017 18:07 
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Nothing counters a car-boner quicker than thinking of the Pontiac Aztec!


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 Post subject: Re: Gas Guzzling Money Pits
PostPosted: Fri Nov 17, 2017 18:08 
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I love it when I vehemently disagree with Grim… in one thread, then agree completely with him in another.

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 Post subject: Re: Gas Guzzling Money Pits
PostPosted: Fri Nov 17, 2017 18:09 
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Oh man, that is indeed the proverbial cold shower.
I'd still take one over an EV though! :)

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 Post subject: Re: Gas Guzzling Money Pits
PostPosted: Fri Nov 17, 2017 18:09 
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Lonewolves wrote:
I love it when I vehemently disagree with Grim… in one thread, then agree completely with him in another.


Which thread did you agree with him? ;)

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 Post subject: Re: Gas Guzzling Money Pits
PostPosted: Sat Nov 18, 2017 19:05 
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Lonewolves wrote:
The only Audi I'd ever consider buying if somehow money became no object:

Image

http://www.thetelegraphandargus.co.uk/n ... _injuries/

Comes with risk.

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 Post subject: Re: Gas Guzzling Money Pits
PostPosted: Sat Nov 18, 2017 21:42 
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MaliA wrote:
Lonewolves wrote:
The only Audi I'd ever consider buying if somehow money became no object:

Image

http://www.thetelegraphandargus.co.uk/n ... _injuries/

Comes with risk.

I'd also hire a security team.

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 Post subject: Re: Gas Guzzling Money Pits
PostPosted: Sun Nov 19, 2017 15:44 
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And that's that for the Type-R, collecting this tomorrow.

I love the Type-R, it's awesome, but it's too crazy for this world. You know how being a terrorist is illegal but also inciting terrorism is illegal?

Dangerous driving is illegal, and the FK2 Type-R is an incitement to dangerous driving and should also be illegal.

I will not publicly list the number of cars I overtook in a single manoeuvre last week, or how fast I was going as I got to the end of the line of traffic, or how I was thinking to myself 'If the car behind the car at the front of this queue decides to overtake, and doesn't see me coming (at some 'considerable pace') in their mirrors before pulling out, it's going to be very messy'.

Anyway, this is a Seat Leon FR Technology. It has a 2 litre turbo diesel engine putting out 184bhp and it does millions of miles to the gallon. It is four months old and has done 2500 miles. I am exchanging the Type-R for it and the dealer is also going to give me £1000 cash.

It has lots of nice toys and the infotainment system is well good, it has full Android/Apple integration so you can do loads of phone shit on the car's screen.

It's a pleasant car to drive, it seemed very comfortable and the lights are really snazzy.

I'm glad I had the chance to own and drive an FK2 Type-R, but it's fucking mental and it belongs on the track.

Attachment:
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Attachment:
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Attachment:
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 Post subject: Re: Gas Guzzling Money Pits
PostPosted: Sun Nov 19, 2017 16:38 
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I see the pattern now:
Boring car
Crazy car
Boring car
Crazy car

Can't wait to see the next crazy car in Feb.

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 Post subject: Re: Gas Guzzling Money Pits
PostPosted: Sun Nov 19, 2017 17:33 
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It's a perfectly worthy car, Hearthly, but what possessed you to buy it? We both know it's never going to scratch any automotive itch you're likely to be having anytime soon, and so you'll be trading it in at a £2k loss in 2-3 months. Stop kidding yourself, just get the car you actually want and then keep it for a bit; you ain't Mister Sensible any more than I am!

iPhone compatibility and toys etc. are no substitute for charisma. Fine if you're a dull, boring 'it gets me from A to B' drone, but you're just not, which in my book is a good (if expensive) thing.

No idea why you don't do as I suggested: get a worthy family car for £10k and a Caterham for £15k, for the weekends (which basically never loses any depreciation and is better, more interactive and more rewarding to drive than any £25k hot hatch. Not sure about iPhone compatibility though ;) )

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 Post subject: Re: Gas Guzzling Money Pits
PostPosted: Sun Nov 19, 2017 17:40 
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Cavey, what are the bits at about shoulder height on the seats of a Cayman? Do they tip forwards?

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 Post subject: Re: Gas Guzzling Money Pits
PostPosted: Sun Nov 19, 2017 17:43 
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MaliA wrote:
Cavey, what are the bits at about shoulder height on the seats of a Cayman? Do they tip forwards?


Got a piccy so I know what you mean?
My GT4 has the 918 Spyder's carbon fibre jobbies optioned, which are one-piece.

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 Post subject: Re: Gas Guzzling Money Pits
PostPosted: Sun Nov 19, 2017 17:50 
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Cavey wrote:
MaliA wrote:
Cavey, what are the bits at about shoulder height on the seats of a Cayman? Do they tip forwards?


Got a piccy so I know what you mean?
My GT4 has the 918 Spyder's carbon fibre jobbies optioned, which are one-piece.


The silver bits


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 Post subject: Re: Gas Guzzling Money Pits
PostPosted: Sun Nov 19, 2017 17:54 
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That's the handle you lift up, then you flip down the stop half of the seat and gain access to the back of the seat, if something had fallen down there or is under the seat.

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 Post subject: Re: Gas Guzzling Money Pits
PostPosted: Sun Nov 19, 2017 18:02 
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Is it not just that they used the same seats from the ones with the tiny little back seats? Seems a lot of engineering to do just in case someone loses something down the back of the seat.


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 Post subject: Re: Gas Guzzling Money Pits
PostPosted: Sun Nov 19, 2017 18:03 
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Oh, probably, but it very, very occasionally comes in useful.

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 Post subject: Re: Gas Guzzling Money Pits
PostPosted: Sun Nov 19, 2017 18:12 
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Gogmagog

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Ta. I was parked next to one earlier (had winter tyres on) and was idly curious before I fell asleep.

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 Post subject: Re: Gas Guzzling Money Pits
PostPosted: Sun Nov 19, 2017 18:28 
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Cavey wrote:
It's a perfectly worthy car, Hearthly, but what possessed you to buy it? We both know it's never going to scratch any automotive itch you're likely to be having anytime soon, and so you'll be trading it in at a £2k loss in 2-3 months.


That's pretty much a given regardless of what car he bought.


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 Post subject: Re: Gas Guzzling Money Pits
PostPosted: Sun Nov 19, 2017 18:32 
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Location: The Golden Country
:D

I'm an optimist... ;)

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 Post subject: Re: Gas Guzzling Money Pits
PostPosted: Sun Nov 19, 2017 19:17 
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Sitting balls-back folder

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People will fuck you up no matter how fast you're going when you overtake them (or in any other situation). Having the go and stop of a performance car is a safety feature in my mind.

The other week I was overtaking someone doing 40 in a 60. As I started moving in front of them having accelerated to 60ish and a car came round the bend a couple of hundred yards away they put their foot down, but I didn't notice immediately. stuck between a rock and a hard place I put the other couple of hundred ftlb in and finished the overtake instead of emergency braking (my car has very big brakes but it accelerates in frankly terrifying fashion from 40+).

It's the first time I've thought that someone literally decided to try and kill me rather than just being a penis.

I don't even drive a stupid-to-look-at car though I guess BMW drivers must be punished at any opportunity.


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 Post subject: Re: Gas Guzzling Money Pits
PostPosted: Sun Nov 19, 2017 19:24 
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Yeah, dawdlers who then accelerate as fast as they can just because you have the temerity to overtake them have to be one of my biggest pet hates on the road. The solution, as you suggest, is to have more power, not less. :D

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 Post subject: Re: Gas Guzzling Money Pits
PostPosted: Sun Nov 19, 2017 19:30 
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I hate people who do 40 in a 60 then carry on into a 30 at 40 more. At least people who behave like a twat when I overtake are paying SOME kind of attention.


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 Post subject: Re: Gas Guzzling Money Pits
PostPosted: Sun Nov 19, 2017 19:43 
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Heh. Well, just do what I do and undertake them. Easy peasy. :)

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 Post subject: Re: Gas Guzzling Money Pits
PostPosted: Mon Nov 20, 2017 9:25 
SupaMod
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Cavey wrote:
Heh. Well, just do what I do and undertake them. Easy peasy. :)

Not many 30mph roads that have enough lanes for that, I'd have thought.

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 Post subject: Re: Gas Guzzling Money Pits
PostPosted: Mon Nov 20, 2017 11:09 
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I've been thinking which is more likely to cause an accident: Driving under the limit in the Right Lane, or undertaking at speed?

Hmm...

Of course, if bumblers just got out of the fucking way, we wouldn't have a problem. The Rockferry Bypass on the A41 is a two-lane 50mph road with no junctions along its 2.5mile (ish) length. People still dawdle in the right land at 45. Dicks.


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 Post subject: Re: Gas Guzzling Money Pits
PostPosted: Mon Nov 20, 2017 11:12 
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60mph dual carriageways aren't 30mph roads.

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Dr Lave wrote:
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 Post subject: Re: Gas Guzzling Money Pits
PostPosted: Mon Nov 20, 2017 11:24 
SupaMod
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I think you might have missed a post, Cavey :)

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 Post subject: Re: Gas Guzzling Money Pits
PostPosted: Mon Nov 20, 2017 16:53 
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Hello Hello Hello

Joined: 11th May, 2008
Posts: 13381
Seat Leon get!

EXCITING ANDROID AUTO STUFF:

Android Auto is awesome. You have to plug your phone in using a cable which sucks a bit, then say YES/APPROVE/AGREE to about three million permission screens and some updates for the app on the phone itself, and thereafter it really is phone stuff but on your car's touchscreen.

Since Mrs Hearthly was with me I asked her to send me a WhatsApp message to test it and it popped up on the car's screen with her icon and everything, and then when I tapped it on it the car read out the message to me. She was tickled by this and then bombarded me with messages such as 'Show me your big dick', 'I like big butts and I cannot lie', 'See my big boobies', and a load of Simpsons names from when Bart used to ring up Moe's asking for 'Hugh Jass' and suchlike, all of which the car dutifully read out until I was forced to ban her from interacting with the technology any further.

It also gives you a little button to tap reading 'I'm driving right now' which auto-sends that message back.

I've still got to have a more thorough play with it but I was very impressed. You can do voice commands for everything as well and interact with it just like the normal Google Assistant on a phone.

Probably worth plugging in a cable for, it's that good.

BORING ACTUAL CAR STUFF:

It's exactly what you would expect, an Audi A3 estate wearing a Spanish wig and costing substantially less than its VW/Audi cousins.

Very nice to drive, was indicating 50mpg for our journey, comfortable, reasonably swift, lovely infotainment system although missing a few toys that the Type-R had (which I already knew about).

So gone are reversing camera (meh), auto-dimming rear view mirror (that stings a bit), road sign recognition (not overly useful but I thought it was cool), auto lights (never used them), auto wipers (would rather have than not), keyless entry and ignition (woohoo fuck off keyless!).

But yeah, it's a Seat Leon estate so nothing to get too excited about, the lights are really cool though (see video below) and it has RGB ambient lighting in the cabin that you can choose the colour of.

Not a bad motor at all TBH.



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