Be Excellent To Each Other

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 Post subject: Re: Bits and Bobs 49
PostPosted: Mon Dec 04, 2017 18:11 
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Sleepyhead

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Findus Fop wrote:
Mimi wrote:
Beef lasagne: shit. You’d rather have horse.

Yeah, we all know the extent of your culinary ideals, Findus.


I'll have you know that horse was just resting in my pancake.


:DD

LLOL.

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 Post subject: Re: Bits and Bobs 49
PostPosted: Mon Dec 04, 2017 18:12 
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Very good. :)


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 Post subject: Re: Bits and Bobs 49
PostPosted: Tue Dec 05, 2017 0:59 
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Paws for thought

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Findus Fop wrote:
Mr Dave wrote:
DavPaz wrote:
My rigorous vetting process to see if I like cake:

Step 1: Is it cake?

I like it.

I used to think like this, but then I came across the most unholy courgette cake. Nobody liked that. I believe it went in the bin. (after about 15 people had tried it, none managing to finish even a single slice)


I've enjoyed a nice courgette cake before. Though it's very important that it's not JUST a courgette cake. There needs to be some fun flavouring in there, as the courgette is just bringing the moistness.

It had lots of chocolate. The courgette mainly brought the superglue. (As in the damn thing set solid in your mouth.)


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 Post subject: Re: Bits and Bobs 49
PostPosted: Tue Dec 05, 2017 9:43 
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I have to say, it's quite nice being able to listen to test match special on my morning commute and be able to have the cricket on TV in the office. As a bonus, it's actually looking to be a decent contest.


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 Post subject: Re: Bits and Bobs 49
PostPosted: Tue Dec 05, 2017 10:04 
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Gogmagog

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N00b tears and wants all games to have all the ways to play them. Thanks to meatyangel for commenting o it on Facebook.

Quote:
Sticking a bonnet on B.J. and infantilizing the player by analogy isn’t exactly an invitation to explore playing Wolfenstein 2 differently. Even just calling one difficulty setting “normal” implies the others are deviant. When you’re fighting to liberate the country from people who believe in eugenics in a game that celebrates difference and diversity, moralizing the difficulty around the struggle (easy equals lazy/bad, hard equals virtuous/good) feels archaic.

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 Post subject: Re: Bits and Bobs 49
PostPosted: Tue Dec 05, 2017 10:09 
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I'm a computery guy!

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I don't get it. Are people upset about being passively mocked for playing games on easy? id games have always done that.


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 Post subject: Re: Bits and Bobs 49
PostPosted: Tue Dec 05, 2017 10:20 
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Let's also spare a second to contemplate on how seven difficulty levels is clearly too fucking many difficulty levels. Some product manager needs to read The Paradox Of Choice.

(Also, new Wolf and Doom aren't by iD, haven't been for years.)


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 Post subject: Re: Bits and Bobs 49
PostPosted: Tue Dec 05, 2017 10:21 
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Gogmagog

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DavPaz wrote:
I don't get it. Are people upset about being passively mocked for playing games on easy? id games have always done that.


Nazi kill him when he wants to pick Edelweiss so shouldn't there be a game mode just with Edelweiss and no Nazis. The overblown masculinity also semi to cause issues.

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 Post subject: Re: Bits and Bobs 49
PostPosted: Tue Dec 05, 2017 10:23 
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I'm a computery guy!

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Doctor Glyndwr wrote:
(Also, new Wolf and Doom aren't by iD, haven't been for years.)


True. But it's the same... (idiom, sir?) ... yes, idiom.


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 Post subject: Re: Bits and Bobs 49
PostPosted: Tue Dec 05, 2017 10:27 
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Rude Belittler

Joined: 30th Mar, 2008
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Curiosity wrote:
Findus Fop wrote:
Mimi wrote:
Beef lasagne: shit. You’d rather have horse.

Yeah, we all know the extent of your culinary ideals, Findus.


I'll have you know that horse was just resting in my pancake.


:DD

LLOL.


You know, since the horsemeat scandal, cheap burgers and lasagne are way worse. Bring back horsey burgers!

(I have horse jerky, and thats awesome. The only way I like horses is in my belly.)


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 Post subject: Re: Bits and Bobs 49
PostPosted: Tue Dec 05, 2017 10:32 
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DavPaz wrote:
I have to say, it's quite nice being able to listen to test match special on my morning commute and be able to have the cricket on TV in the office. As a bonus, it's actually looking to be a decent contest.

Err what? It's a shellacking


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 Post subject: Re: Bits and Bobs 49
PostPosted: Tue Dec 05, 2017 10:35 
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I'm a computery guy!

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Lonewolves wrote:
DavPaz wrote:
I have to say, it's quite nice being able to listen to test match special on my morning commute and be able to have the cricket on TV in the office. As a bonus, it's actually looking to be a decent contest.

Err what? It's a shellacking

Shush.


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 Post subject: Re: Bits and Bobs 49
PostPosted: Tue Dec 05, 2017 10:36 
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Isn't that lovely?

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Lonewolves wrote:
DavPaz wrote:
I have to say, it's quite nice being able to listen to test match special on my morning commute and be able to have the cricket on TV in the office. As a bonus, it's actually looking to be a decent contest.

Err what? It's a shellacking


The last 24 hours or so have brought about that most dangerous of thing. Hope!

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 Post subject: Re: Bits and Bobs 49
PostPosted: Tue Dec 05, 2017 11:04 
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Rude Belittler

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MaliA wrote:
N00b tears and wants all games to have all the ways to play them. Thanks to meatyangel for commenting o it on Facebook.



I agree with him.

I've played through Wolfenstein 2 on 'Bring it on!', and it really is quite uneven difficulty wise. SOme bits are bloody infuriating, some bits are easy as pie. There's bits where it seems to want to be nu-Doom, (here's a small area, defend it, but enemies come from everywhere so don't try to find cover and turtle), but BJ ain't Doomguy, he can't take as much punishment.

I can see how dropping it to easy might help even things out.

If I was designing a difficulty menu for this particular game, I'd go with:

*Story (easy combat and stealth)
*Stealth (focus on the stealth aspect, slightly dumber enemies, slightly weaker enemies, more punishment for getting caught, but ability to reset the alert status by hiding)
*Rock and Roll (combat focused, tougher BJ, more ammo, more health and armour pickups, no stealth aspects at all)
*Full Monty (Game as presented)
*Legendary (for the masochists)


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 Post subject: Re: Bits and Bobs 49
PostPosted: Tue Dec 05, 2017 12:07 
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Soopah red DS

Joined: 2nd Jun, 2008
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Malc wrote:
Lonewolves wrote:
DavPaz wrote:
I have to say, it's quite nice being able to listen to test match special on my morning commute and be able to have the cricket on TV in the office. As a bonus, it's actually looking to be a decent contest.

Err what? It's a shellacking


The last 24 hours or so have brought about that most dangerous of thing. Hope!


Oh man. 2-0 down would still probably lead to a huge overall defeat. But my, it's close overall. I am in Adelaide (outskirts). I did not go. Tomorrow, entry is by 'gold coin donation' (so, a quid). I am on a bus.

Still freaking excited. After 2013-14, just being in a contest is enough for me. But...but...it might be more.


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 Post subject: Re: Bits and Bobs 49
PostPosted: Tue Dec 05, 2017 12:08 
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I agree too. It's the worst kind of toxic masculinity on show.

And the cricket too. :D


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 Post subject: Re: Bits and Bobs 49
PostPosted: Tue Dec 05, 2017 12:23 
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Pundabaya wrote:
MaliA wrote:
N00b tears and wants all games to have all the ways to play them. Thanks to meatyangel for commenting o it on Facebook.



I agree with him.

I've played through Wolfenstein 2 on 'Bring it on!', and it really is quite uneven difficulty wise. SOme bits are bloody infuriating, some bits are easy as pie. There's bits where it seems to want to be nu-Doom, (here's a small area, defend it, but enemies come from everywhere so don't try to find cover and turtle), but BJ ain't Doomguy, he can't take as much punishment.

I can see how dropping it to easy might help even things out.

If I was designing a difficulty menu for this particular game, I'd go with:

*Story (easy combat and stealth)
*Stealth (focus on the stealth aspect, slightly dumber enemies, slightly weaker enemies, more punishment for getting caught, but ability to reset the alert status by hiding)
*Rock and Roll (combat focused, tougher BJ, more ammo, more health and armour pickups, no stealth aspects at all)
*Full Monty (Game as presented)
*Legendary (for the masochists)


Western developers can't seem to even do 3 difficulty settings right (usually higher difficulty is just upping enemies HP and damage) and you want even more difficulty settings? If they aren't willing to put as much effort as japanese developers into the difficulty settings, they should just focus on one.

And I wish developers wouldn't listen to the kind of games sites like Kotaku and Polygon. They are a joke but apparently their opinions still have some weight in the industry. Why should every game be for everyone? It's perfectly fine for some games to be hard and others easy and the consumer to choose. It's better to developers to focus on their vision and make the best game they can. Nintendo games have been laughably easy for ages and it's fine (haven't played the latest zelda so can't comment on that one). They're just not for me.


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 Post subject: Re: Bits and Bobs 49
PostPosted: Tue Dec 05, 2017 12:34 
Filthy Junkie Bitch

Joined: 17th Dec, 2008
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I’ve often thought this in the past. Largely when I was shit at a game, and on limited lives (and restart from the beginning) you would often be denied the whole game. Not so much an issue these days but still.
Quote:
As more AAA games focus on open world design, the idea of needing to “earn” the exploration parts by completing familiar repetitive tasks like “go kill some dude” or “collect a bunch of random stuff feels” almost criminal. People spend years of their lives creating different parts of a game that most people, even the ones who buy it, will probably never see, especially if it’s toward the end.


“Thanks for your money, but you’re not good enough to play all the game you just paid for”


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 Post subject: Re: Bits and Bobs 49
PostPosted: Tue Dec 05, 2017 12:45 
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Basically you need to grow a pair/man up/insert as applicable.


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 Post subject: Re: Bits and Bobs 49
PostPosted: Tue Dec 05, 2017 12:46 
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Gogmagog

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Insert sideways as applicable, surely?

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 Post subject: Re: Bits and Bobs 49
PostPosted: Tue Dec 05, 2017 12:47 
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Gogmagog

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ApplePieOfDestiny wrote:
I’ve often thought this in the past. Largely when I was shit at a game, and on limited lives (and restart from the beginning) you would often be denied the whole game. Not so much an issue these days but still.
Quote:
As more AAA games focus on open world design, the idea of needing to “earn” the exploration parts by completing familiar repetitive tasks like “go kill some dude” or “collect a bunch of random stuff feels” almost criminal. People spend years of their lives creating different parts of a game that most people, even the ones who buy it, will probably never see, especially if it’s toward the end.


“Thanks for your money, but you’re not good enough to play all the game you just paid for”


I agree with that. I disagree with "shooting games must remove baddies so we can collect rainbows all day"

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 Post subject: Re: Bits and Bobs 49
PostPosted: Tue Dec 05, 2017 12:48 
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MaliA wrote:
ApplePieOfDestiny wrote:
I’ve often thought this in the past. Largely when I was shit at a game, and on limited lives (and restart from the beginning) you would often be denied the whole game. Not so much an issue these days but still.
Quote:
As more AAA games focus on open world design, the idea of needing to “earn” the exploration parts by completing familiar repetitive tasks like “go kill some dude” or “collect a bunch of random stuff feels” almost criminal. People spend years of their lives creating different parts of a game that most people, even the ones who buy it, will probably never see, especially if it’s toward the end.


“Thanks for your money, but you’re not good enough to play all the game you just paid for”


I agree with that. I disagree with "shooting games must remove baddies so we can collect rainbows all day"

No one has said that. As per usual you miss the point. No one is taking your shooty games away.


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 Post subject: Re: Bits and Bobs 49
PostPosted: Tue Dec 05, 2017 12:49 
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I've been playing Horizon Zero Dawn a lot lately, and on one of the loading screens it basically says there's nothing wrong with 'easy' because it let's you get on and enjoy the story. Which is why there is so much effort in making it a good story.

Games costs lots of money to make so need marketing to the widest audience before they make that back, let alone turn a profit. If you want a great game that is engaging and looks good then you have to accept someone's 12yo neice who got a PS4 for Christmas might want to play it on easy to get to grips with it. That is what keeps people interested in playing and spending money on games, it wasn't so inclusive there wouldn't be the same level of investment and there wouldn't be the amazing range of games and pursuit of technology that there is now.

I'll go back through a game on easy to mop up the collectables if I'm inclined to. I wouldn't bother if it had a single difficulty setting and I knew I was going to get my ass repeatedly handed to me again, until I eventually got through. I might attempt it on super hard mode if I really want a trophy but I don't think I've ever done that. Why should my gaming experience be reduced, or confined to 'kids games' because of that?

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 Post subject: Re: Bits and Bobs 49
PostPosted: Tue Dec 05, 2017 12:51 
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Gogmagog

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Lonewolves wrote:
MaliA wrote:
ApplePieOfDestiny wrote:
I’ve often thought this in the past. Largely when I was shit at a game, and on limited lives (and restart from the beginning) you would often be denied the whole game. Not so much an issue these days but still.
Quote:
As more AAA games focus on open world design, the idea of needing to “earn” the exploration parts by completing familiar repetitive tasks like “go kill some dude” or “collect a bunch of random stuff feels” almost criminal. People spend years of their lives creating different parts of a game that most people, even the ones who buy it, will probably never see, especially if it’s toward the end.


“Thanks for your money, but you’re not good enough to play all the game you just paid for”


I agree with that. I disagree with "shooting games must remove baddies so we can collect rainbows all day"

No one has said that. As per usual you miss the point. No one is taking your shooty games away.


Here:
Quote:
In Wolfenstein 2 difficulty affects how quickly things die, including you. Sometimes it also changes how many enemies there are and where they’re placed. Story beats and how environments are constructed remain the same though. Rather than offer different modes that emphasize different ways of playing the game, like focusing on stealth or limited combat exploration, the settings are just a knob waiting to be cranked up to 11.

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 Post subject: Re: Bits and Bobs 49
PostPosted: Tue Dec 05, 2017 12:57 
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flis wrote:
I've been playing Horizon Zero Dawn a lot lately, and on one of the loading screens it basically says there's nothing wrong with 'easy' because it let's you get on and enjoy the story. Which is why there is so much effort in making it a good story.

Games costs lots of money to make so need marketing to the widest audience before they make that back, let alone turn a profit. If you want a great game that is engaging and looks good then you have to accept someone's 12yo neice who got a PS4 for Christmas might want to play it on easy to get to grips with it. That is what keeps people interested in playing and spending money on games, it wasn't so inclusive there wouldn't be the same level of investment and there wouldn't be the amazing range of games and pursuit of technology that there is now.

I'll go back through a game on easy to mop up the collectables if I'm inclined to. I wouldn't bother if it had a single difficulty setting and I knew I was going to get my ass repeatedly handed to me again, until I eventually got through. I might attempt it on super hard mode if I really want a trophy but I don't think I've ever done that. Why should my gaming experience be reduced, or confined to 'kids games' because of that?


Apparently the problem with Kotaku is that they got offended over the joke of Wolf2 difficulty settings. Most AAA have these multiple difficulty settings, so I don't know why they are arguing about. But if i'm thinking about a lesser evil situation, better give me all those difficulty settings but don't ever put level scaling in a game like in Oblivion.

And is it bad business to exclude part of your audience due to difficulty? Cuphead and Dark Souls did it and were massive successes.


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 Post subject: Re: Bits and Bobs 49
PostPosted: Tue Dec 05, 2017 13:01 
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I never finish games anyway. And I use god mode


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 Post subject: Re: Bits and Bobs 49
PostPosted: Tue Dec 05, 2017 13:01 
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Joined: 27th Mar, 2008
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MaliA wrote:
Lonewolves wrote:
MaliA wrote:
ApplePieOfDestiny wrote:
I’ve often thought this in the past. Largely when I was shit at a game, and on limited lives (and restart from the beginning) you would often be denied the whole game. Not so much an issue these days but still.
Quote:
As more AAA games focus on open world design, the idea of needing to “earn” the exploration parts by completing familiar repetitive tasks like “go kill some dude” or “collect a bunch of random stuff feels” almost criminal. People spend years of their lives creating different parts of a game that most people, even the ones who buy it, will probably never see, especially if it’s toward the end.


“Thanks for your money, but you’re not good enough to play all the game you just paid for”


I agree with that. I disagree with "shooting games must remove baddies so we can collect rainbows all day"

No one has said that. As per usual you miss the point. No one is taking your shooty games away.


Here:
Quote:
In Wolfenstein 2 difficulty affects how quickly things die, including you. Sometimes it also changes how many enemies there are and where they’re placed. Story beats and how environments are constructed remain the same though. Rather than offer different modes that emphasize different ways of playing the game, like focusing on stealth or limited combat exploration, the settings are just a knob waiting to be cranked up to 11.

Offering different modes is not taking your game away. Read it again.


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 Post subject: Re: Bits and Bobs 49
PostPosted: Tue Dec 05, 2017 13:03 
SupaMod
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RuySan wrote:
Why should every game be for everyone?

Because it's got lightsabres in, apparently ;)

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 Post subject: Re: Bits and Bobs 49
PostPosted: Tue Dec 05, 2017 13:04 
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RuySan wrote:
flis wrote:
I've been playing Horizon Zero Dawn a lot lately, and on one of the loading screens it basically says there's nothing wrong with 'easy' because it let's you get on and enjoy the story. Which is why there is so much effort in making it a good story.

Games costs lots of money to make so need marketing to the widest audience before they make that back, let alone turn a profit. If you want a great game that is engaging and looks good then you have to accept someone's 12yo neice who got a PS4 for Christmas might want to play it on easy to get to grips with it. That is what keeps people interested in playing and spending money on games, it wasn't so inclusive there wouldn't be the same level of investment and there wouldn't be the amazing range of games and pursuit of technology that there is now.

I'll go back through a game on easy to mop up the collectables if I'm inclined to. I wouldn't bother if it had a single difficulty setting and I knew I was going to get my ass repeatedly handed to me again, until I eventually got through. I might attempt it on super hard mode if I really want a trophy but I don't think I've ever done that. Why should my gaming experience be reduced, or confined to 'kids games' because of that?


Apparently the problem with Kotaku is that they got offended over the joke of Wolf2 difficulty settings. Most AAA have these multiple difficulty settings, so I don't know why they are arguing about. But if i'm thinking about a lesser evil situation, better give me all those difficulty settings but don't ever put level scaling in a game like in Oblivion.

And is it bad business to exclude part of your audience due to difficulty? Cuphead and Dark Souls did it and were massive successes.

It's only a funny joke if you're a 12yo gamergate edgelord. If it's satire then it's very poor.


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 Post subject: Re: Bits and Bobs 49
PostPosted: Tue Dec 05, 2017 13:42 
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Lonewolves wrote:
Offering different modes is not taking your game away. Read it again.


You read what Mali said again. He's saying that games shouldn't just remove bad guys from the game for easy mode. It should be the same game, just easier. You've completely got his point wrong.

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