Be Excellent To Each Other

Ah, I disagree on that. I don't think they need to carry on with Win32 support. There's nothing whatsoever stopping them building a version of .NET that runs on Win10 machines that uses none of Win32 - but is just as easy to develop for as existing Win32 .NET is today.

I assume you mean end users and not the folks responsible for corporate IT systems

Correct.

They just get given what the corporation decides. I am guessing most most office products won't be affected.

http://www.dualshockers.com/2016/03/16/ ... -and-more/



They also note they are fixing the most glaring holes in UWP for gaming "real soon now" (vsync, SLI, etc.)

I think this means in the future Microsoft is thinking Xbox will be subsumed into Windows, and no longer the discrete platform and hardware it is today. Imagine GfWL combined with DirectX and branded as Xbox, with a couple of console-sized Surface PCs to cover off the first party hardware support -- and then also third party hardware at a range of price points a la Steam Boxes.

This feels like a change of heart. I wonder if the Xbone's lacklustre sales against the PS4 has led to a shift in the balance of power within MS and now the Windows division has the upper hand over the Xbox division, so is getting to set the strategy to suit itself.

Well that would line up with comments about them looking at incremental hardware updates, and an XBoneAnnaHalf would let them catch up on the perceived PS4 performance advantage.
https://www.vg247.com/2016/03/01/xbox-o ... -upgrades/

I don't think they have addressed all the glaring holes in UWP.

They have claimed that they plan to let you sell UWP software from places other than the Windows App Store, but it is not currently possible, and it's not clear what restrictions/barriers/limitations there will be on doing so.

If UWP means that game devs cannot sell games on Steam, I think game devs will still rely on Win32 (either in addition to or instead of UWP).

UWP isn't a replacement for Win32, the two aren't really comparable. UWP is closer to MFC or .NET - a set of wrapper classes for system APIs rather than a fundamental part of the underlying OS.

but win 32 can be phased out?

Well, technically anything can be phased out at any time. What are actually asking though?

I am just trying to get my head round the problem.

Craster seems to se it as ok, Lewie as the sky is falling in....

I suspect the choice will be:

1) write a game for UWP, distribute on Windows Store, get cross-platform APIs, game works on Xbox and Win10 with minimal fettling >> the new option
2) write a game for Win32/DirectX legacy, distribute game on Steam, write and optimise a different game for Xbox >> same as today

Whether MS can make (1) appealing to devs via carrots (eg. UWP exclusive APIs) is up for debate. Also you still need to optimise the game engine for PS4 anyway, so the efficiency savings of (1) may not be as great as they sound. This all sounds like a typical MS example of strategy-first, technology-later, where the strategy is "UWP replaces Xbox" and the technical details are being reverse engineered from that goal.

Oh, and Win32 isn't going to be deprecated, that's madness.

As a software giant, I am more inclined to agree with Craster.

An auspicious start for UWP/Windows 10 with Gears Of War Ultimate Edition.....

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/digit ... iver-on-pc

Yeah I heard it was really bad. I wish Microsoft would go Steam or Origin or something that actually works for their games. I quite enjoyed the first GOW on PC. It looked stunning too (proper DX10 job).

I'm amazed they've pushed it out of the door in this kind of state, after GFWL they really needed to make sure this thing works perfectly right from the off.

On top of that they're going up against Steam, which is very well established, and works. Ditto Origin (which I know was pretty awful in its early days but really is just fine these days).

Even uPlay which I previously detested seems pretty solid now, and it all works fine, (I'm having to use it again to play The Division).

Against that backdrop, and given that I think it's fair to say MS aren't much liked or trusted by PC gamers in this field, and given the resources MS has at its disposal - I have no idea what the hell they were thinking about with this.

Then again we have to be clear what MS want out of UWP, which is control of the store and the ecosystem and the money that comes with it, and TBH I don't think PC gamers are going to bite at all - like we're going to forget they just turned off GFWL, for example. (And even when it was turned on it was shit and clunky and only used begrudgingly, Steam/Origin's own integration systems work massively better. All I want from Windows is an operating system I can run all my other stuff on, which is why Windows 10 holds no interest for me at all.)

It's a shame because I really do welcome Microsoft back. They used to make some fine PC games back in the day (Midtown Madness, Motocross Madness and so on). Then the Xbox came along and that was that.

So it's really nice to see them back on the PC but the Windows Store thing is never going to work. Apparently the games run in windowed mode which means Crossfire will never work. And that's a huge problem for me.

I agree about Origin and Uplay. They have both improved a lot and now do just as they should do. It's a bit of a pain running three different apps (Steam Origin and Uplay) but I have all of them blocked at startup so opening them when I see fit is no problem.

PC gaming lolz
http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/digit ... iver-on-pc

Not reading (x) posts?

Nah.

Still, worth getting the PC snark in, eh?

Clearly tongue in cheek and also totally out of context for the thread it was in, plus not so rude as it ignored the four posts directly preceding it in the thread.

Keep your hair on. I am a PC gamer as well, you know!

Sorry shit day at work I'm being unnecessarily prickly.

And now Myp is kissing you. It can't get any worse.

He could be kissing back.

Can't it Dave? Can't it?

I've been saying that since .net 1.0. Why can they add a Linux 'native' nt subsystem but continue to insist that .net be a bug-ridden shit-pile working around win32 by adding layers and layers of new awful?

I love c#. Love it. Hate going back to c++. But Jesus, why was 'Nt subsystem' not a day 1 requirement of the CLR?

Amazingly I get to input into this thread
Just bought three Lenovo i7 lappys with Windows10 installed, which is better than XP I guess.
It all seems very lovely for now......

Recently I've tried connecting to a network share on my Win10 desktop from a couple of Android devices over my wifi and can't do it. This has worked before with the same app (ES File Explorer) so it's certainly been possible in the past and I'm willing to blame Windows 10 at the moment. I can see the machine from the Android devices but when I try to log in it just fails. With Windows 10 I'm logged in with my Microsoft acount rather than a straight local machine account and I suspect this is what's causing the problem, though I've nothing to back that up per se. Can someone else try this and see if they can get it working? I've made sure to share the folder in Windows and I've tried a few different ways of connecting from Android to no avail.

The same thing happened to me with my Windows phone and windows 10 PC. I wish I could tell you how I fixed it but in the end, I had a new phone and that solved the problem.

Is your live account an actual local account on the Windows machine? I don't know how that shit works

I'm not clear on if it's never worked in Windows 10 at all, or it did work but now it doesn't. (Was it Windows 7 when it last worked?)

I was just going to comment and say it works fine for me, but then I remembered that my file server is still on windows 7.

So this post is pointless.

Thinking about it, I don't think it matters that you're logged in with your Windows account. Is the Android app the latest one? I know there's a new version of it on the Lumia but you can still get the old one from the store AND it's higher in the rankings annoyingly.

Also, have you tried turning Windows defender off and trying it? See if that's the problem.

Basically, yeah; so I sign into Windows with that login and it appears in the Accounts control panel in Windows.



Aye, Windows 7 was the last time it worked.



Yeah, the app's up to date.



I don't think I've got that turned on at all as I use Avast for anti-virus but I'll check tonight.

I want to rebuild my home PC, going to go for Windows 10.

I need to upgrade my graphics card, what is a good budget one that will support 2 screen?

These PCs look pretty good:

http://www.banggood.com/Cenovo-Mini-PC- ... 44525.html

"This time we are more than thin"

"2GB RAM, 32GB ROM"???

"rose golden exquisite and amazing"

"It can run in both directions unblockedly and all things are possible"

"One "machine" can hold all"

"a real artifact"

I think it's this that's sold me on it though:

"small as the sparrow is, it possesses all its internal organs"

I've often thought that they should make PCs with all the internal organs of a sparrow.

Pre-ordered.

Mate, you're not going to get one that doesn't support 2 screens these days.

As for budget, what number are you thinking? £30, £300?

cool

About £100 at the most.

Quick google gives me this

http://www.amazon.co.uk/MSI-R7-360-Grap ... ascsubtag=[site%7Cthauk[cat%7C[art%7C[pid%7CB00ZPOE2IC[tid%7C14598519491166565[bbc%7CLEPRIX

Nerdier men than me can debate its merits.

GeForce GTX 750Ti, start at around £90 and have a reasonable amount of gaming poke. They also tend to run near-silently.

https://www.overclockers.co.uk/msi-gefo ... 48-ms.html

Depends if you're interesting in using it for gaming. If so, then the 750Ti is a good purchase. Otherwise just get a GT610 for £20.

https://www.overclockers.co.uk/pc-compo ... rce-gt-610

Hmm. Given the shittiness of the rest of the spec of my machine (4GB of RAM and a Q8200 CPU) how pointless would it be for me to stick one of those in my machine? I'm still not quite ready to do a full upgrade but adding a bit more oomph for under £100 is an attractive idea.

ETA: I've currently got an HD7770 card in there.

cheers...

I've had the GTX 650 for a few years and it's served me well. I'll not be spending any more money on minor upgrades. My next change will be *expensive*

Not sure you'll notice much of a difference TBH, the 750Ti isn't massively more powerful than the 7700 to start with and you may will be limited by the rest of the spec anyway - not worth chucking nearly £100 at IMO.

Fair enough, ta.