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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Sun Feb 26, 2017 21:49 
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Doctor Glyndwr wrote:
Bobbyaro wrote:
doing tech start ups, etc.

Losing freedom of movement with the EU is very bad for the UK tech startup scene. Startups have a strong requirement to recruit the best people they can, but they don't have time or money to spend on sorting out visas. London has enjoyed some success to date because it can easily pull people from all over Europe; but it was already hampered by being too expensive. Post-Brexit I think it'll become less desirable as a place to set up shop.


Exactly why we should be trying to poach the U.S.people who are hacked off, especially as they will most likely only speak English.

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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Sun Feb 26, 2017 22:01 
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Bobbyaro wrote:
Doctor Glyndwr wrote:
Bobbyaro wrote:
doing tech start ups, etc.

Losing freedom of movement with the EU is very bad for the UK tech startup scene. Startups have a strong requirement to recruit the best people they can, but they don't have time or money to spend on sorting out visas. London has enjoyed some success to date because it can easily pull people from all over Europe; but it was already hampered by being too expensive. Post-Brexit I think it'll become less desirable as a place to set up shop.


Exactly why we should be trying to poach the U.S.people who are hacked off, especially as they will most likely only speak English.


I'm not really sure what you're saying here. The language thing was never a barrier for that demographic (English is and continues to be the common language for tech and most other industries worldwide) and if Brexit impacts immigration to the UK then Americans will be hit as hard as anyone else. With Brexit looming, starting up a new company in the UK becomes massively less attractive across the board.


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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Mon Feb 27, 2017 11:55 
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All this talk of 'ending freedom of movement' I'm hearing from the government and Brexit supporters never seems to mention that it ends for us as well. I'm seriously angry about this, and I'm yet to hear any MP actually argue in favour of us losing the right to freely travel, work, and study in 27 other countries.


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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Mon Feb 27, 2017 13:45 
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https://www.ft.com/content/a9ecd5aa-fcd ... e3738f9ae4

Quote:

BMW considers making electric Mini outside UK because of Brexit

Move to quit EU sparks uncertainty over where to manufacture battery-driven car

BMW is considering making an electric version of the Mini outside the UK because of the uncertainty posed by Britain’s decision to leave the EU.

The German carmaker has owned the British marque since 1994 and manufactures all but two models in the UK.

But the first battery-powered edition of the car, which is set to go on sale in 2019, may be manufactured on the continent, the company said.


BMW said a final decision would be taken this year, adding “we’ve got to make sure we have the best business case possible”.

Spokeswoman Emma Begley said: “The result of the EU referendum creates uncertainty for the automotive sector in general and for overseas investors in particular. Uncertainty is not helpful when it comes to making long-term business decisions.”
Sounds like the opening salvo in a negotiation where BMW thinks it has the upper hand.


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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Mon Feb 27, 2017 13:47 
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"What's that deal you did with Nissan? We want some of that."

This could get expensive.

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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Mon Feb 27, 2017 13:57 
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Lonewolves wrote:
"What's that deal you did with Nissan? We want some of that."
Yeah, that's how I read it too.


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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Mon Feb 27, 2017 13:59 
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They'd be stupid not to, to be honest.

Vauxhall need to get on that gravy train.

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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Mon Feb 27, 2017 14:04 
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And Honda, Renault, and the rest.

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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Mon Feb 27, 2017 14:13 
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I suppose it partially depends how credible their alternatives are in each case. They aren't all going to automatically be taken seriously if there's any suspicion that they're not. Ditching a whole workforce, building a new car plant and then training another one probably isn't free.


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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Mon Feb 27, 2017 14:15 
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markg wrote:
Ditching a whole workforce, building a new car plant and then training another one probably isn't free.
There's a reason BMW have started this conversation about "where are we going to invest in the new facilities to build this new product line." There's little sunk cost at stake.


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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Mon Feb 27, 2017 14:15 
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markg wrote:
I suppose it partially depends how credible their alternatives are in each case. They aren't all going to automatically be taken seriously if there's any suspicion that they're not. Ditching a whole workforce, building a new car plant and then training another one probably isn't free.


But if you have to do it anyway, why not change Plant Europe, rather than Plant UK?

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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Tue Feb 28, 2017 9:35 
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I could only find the full text of John Major's speech on the Daily Mirror's website. He makes some very good points on both the nature of Brexit and the politics of it, the majority of which I agree with.

Quote:
My hunch is that, over the years ahead, the political price of leaving the EU may turn out to be greater than the economic cost.


Quote:
Many believed this, yet the bitter irony is that the “divorce settlement” – that is, the cost of leaving Europe – may involve paying out much larger sums of money than that.

The EU Chief Negotiator has estimated that our bill for exit may total between €40 billion to €60 billion.

I find this figure very contentious. But the bill will be substantial: billions, not millions, and very unpalatable. It will come as a nasty shock to voters who were not forewarned of this – even in the recent White Paper.


Quote:
if cars and aerospace were to get favourable deals, why not textiles and widgets? How would the Government soothe the ire of those not receiving preferential treatment?


I've yet to hear any of the leading Leavers provide a riposte that isn't an ad hominem.


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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Tue Feb 28, 2017 14:32 
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Bmw to build eMini in Europe, says a man in The Twitter because Brexit

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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Tue Feb 28, 2017 14:35 
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MaliA wrote:
Bmw to build eMini in Europe, says a man in The Twitter because Brexit


Yeah, but they'll still want to sell them here, won't they? Eh? Eh?


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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Tue Feb 28, 2017 14:36 
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Kern wrote:
MaliA wrote:
Bmw to build eMini in Europe, says a man in The Twitter because Brexit


Yeah, but they'll still want to sell them here, won't they? Eh? Eh?


Hang on, it's a German news article from yesterday and appears that it is more likely than not to build it in Europe, skim reading it. So, no advance on Gaywood from yesterday

http://m.manager-magazin.de/unternehmen ... ww&ref=rss

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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Tue Feb 28, 2017 14:37 
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As already discussed, they want favours from the government. What is this? The 1970s? :0

But seriously, if they do go to Germany, that's a heck of a blow to Oxford. Still, I guess we could use the land for housing.


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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Fri Mar 03, 2017 14:52 
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Scorching thread on Twitter from someone who owns a (profitable) farm and is now buying up the Brexit-voting neighbouring farms for heavy discounts because they're not going to be sustainable without EU subsidies.

https://twitter.com/ImAnitaSharma/statu ... 1441240064


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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Fri Mar 03, 2017 15:04 
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I can't believe it was only recently I read the classic fable of King Log.


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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Fri Mar 03, 2017 15:11 
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In other Brexit news, today I borrowed two books from the library:

- 'Brexit: what the hell happens now?' by Ian Dunt
- 'What next?' by Daniel Hannan

I'll toss a coin to decide the reading order (Sad then happy, or happy then sad?) , but probably only after I finished George Saunders' 'CivilWarLand in Bad Decline' and possibly Steinbeck's 'Of Mice and Men' both of which I also took out today.


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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Fri Mar 03, 2017 15:12 
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Daniel "absolutely no one is talking about leaving the single market" Hannan?

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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Fri Mar 03, 2017 15:13 
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Funny that, I bought Tim Shipman's All Out War: The Full Story of How Brexit Sank Britain's Political Class last week. Haven't started it yet, haven't been in the mood for non-fiction.


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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Fri Mar 03, 2017 15:14 
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Lonewolves wrote:
Daniel "absolutely no one is talking about leaving the single market" Hannan?


The very same. Also, absolutely no one is talking about Magna Carta and the Levellers either.


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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Fri Mar 03, 2017 15:15 
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Doctor Glyndwr wrote:
Funny that, I bought Tim Shipman's All Out War: The Full Story of How Brexit Sank Britain's Political Class last week. Haven't started it yet, haven't been in the mood for non-fiction.


I read it over New Year. It's a heck of fast-paced pageturner.

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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Fri Mar 03, 2017 15:17 
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I also recently subscribed to the 'New European', because I'm old-school when it comes to my echo-chambers. It's more bath-friendly too.


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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Fri Mar 03, 2017 15:23 
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Kern wrote:
It's more bath-friendly too.


:attitude:

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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Tue Mar 07, 2017 0:12 
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http://news.sky.com/story/uk-prices-ris ... sf-twitter

Quote:
Prices in the UK are now rising at an annual rate of more than 3% in the latest evidence of economic fallout from the EU referendum, according to figures seen by Sky News.

The sharp jump implies that real incomes are falling for the first time since 2014 - the clearest sign yet that households are being squeezed as a result of the decision to leave the EU.

While the UK's official inflation measure, the consumer price index, was 1.8% in January - well below the 2.7% annual rate at which wages are rising - economists have warned that because many of the CPI datapoints are collected manually the index is sometimes slow to reflect sharp changes in prices.

A well-respected measure of UK prices devised by MIT economists and collected from retailers online shows prices have been rising much faster lately.

Philip Hammond will present his first full Budget on Wednesday, but don't expect any fireworks

The PriceStats inflation measure, published by State Street and seen by Sky News, shows that while prices were only rising at an annual rate of less than 1% before the referendum, the rate has risen to 3.3% in recent weeks.

The statistics imply that real wages, pay growth adjusted for inflation, may now be falling at an annual rate of 0.6% - compared with the positive 0.9% growth rate implied by the official inflation data.

We're a net importer in lots of key market segments and our currency is in the shitter. There's a lag from that before we feel the effects in the market but I think it's happening now.


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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Tue Mar 07, 2017 7:40 
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Shame we can't just tax every stupid fucking thimble-brained cunt who voted for this shite.


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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Tue Mar 07, 2017 9:01 
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markg wrote:
Shame we can't just tax every stupid fucking thimble-brained cunt who voted for this shite.

Well, we can. It's just we'd have to tax everyone else, too.

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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Tue Mar 07, 2017 9:24 
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Doctor Glyndwr wrote:
http://news.sky.com/story/uk-prices-rising-faster-after-brexit-vote-10792922?dcmp=snt-sf-twitter

Quote:
Prices in the UK are now rising at an annual rate of more than 3% in the latest evidence of economic fallout from the EU referendum, according to figures seen by Sky News.

The sharp jump implies that real incomes are falling for the first time since 2014 - the clearest sign yet that households are being squeezed as a result of the decision to leave the EU.

While the UK's official inflation measure, the consumer price index, was 1.8% in January - well below the 2.7% annual rate at which wages are rising - economists have warned that because many of the CPI datapoints are collected manually the index is sometimes slow to reflect sharp changes in prices.

A well-respected measure of UK prices devised by MIT economists and collected from retailers online shows prices have been rising much faster lately.

Philip Hammond will present his first full Budget on Wednesday, but don't expect any fireworks

The PriceStats inflation measure, published by State Street and seen by Sky News, shows that while prices were only rising at an annual rate of less than 1% before the referendum, the rate has risen to 3.3% in recent weeks.

The statistics imply that real wages, pay growth adjusted for inflation, may now be falling at an annual rate of 0.6% - compared with the positive 0.9% growth rate implied by the official inflation data.

We're a net importer in lots of key market segments and our currency is in the shitter. There's a lag from that before we feel the effects in the market but I think it's happening now.

But the FTSE 250 doing as well as it was 3 years ago means we're all rich now surely?

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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Tue Mar 07, 2017 9:28 
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I'm so rich I now only eat food from the Tesco Finest ready meal and pizza range. (This is because their normal stuff had taken a definite dive in the quality of the ingredients, and they started bulking out the curries with potatoes and suchlike.)

So they've managed to maintain the same prices (so far at least), but with obvious compromises on quality.

I'm quite the gourmand when it comes to ready meals and as such make a good canary in the mine on this stuff.

Oh yes and their own brand lemonade is 12p more expensive than it used to be.

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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Tue Mar 07, 2017 11:56 
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More from the FT regarding still-early-not-conclusive signs that the economy is slowing: https://www.ft.com/content/45429758-1ce ... 63417131bb

Quote:
The pound dipped below $1.22 against the dollar this morning, slipping after softer than expected readings on UK house prices and retail sales last month and ahead of another House of Lords debate on the triggering of Article 50 today.

Sterling is down 0.25 per cent against the dollar this morning at $1.2199 – the lowest since January 17. The exchange rate has declined for seven of the last eight trading days as latest survey data from the UK economy suggests activity has slowed at the start of the year.
...
Sterling is also softening ahead of Philip Hammond’s first budget due tomorrow, which comes amid a backdrop of a slowing UK economy. Survey data from the private sector and on consumer spending has moderated in 2017, as higher inflation begins to pinch households and raise business import costs.

Earlier today, retail sales figures from the British Retail Consortium were lower than expected in February, with non-food retail sales dipping for the first time since 2011. Meanwhile, the price of goods sold in the country’s supermarkets has grown at the fastest pace in over two years, according to Kantar.


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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Tue Mar 07, 2017 12:05 
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Supermarket sales seem to be lower than expected across the board, so I am told.

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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Tue Mar 07, 2017 12:08 
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MaliA wrote:
Supermarket sales seem to be lower than expected across the board, so I am told.

You know the problem? Filthy poor people using food banks instead of contributing to our marvelous, booming economy. We should ban them.


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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Tue Mar 07, 2017 12:16 
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Doctor Glyndwr wrote:
MaliA wrote:
Supermarket sales seem to be lower than expected across the board, so I am told.

You know the problem? Filthy poor people using food banks instead of contributing to our marvelous, booming economy. We should ban them.


I am adding that to my list of forecastimg excuses

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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Tue Mar 07, 2017 12:21 
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Doctor Glyndwr wrote:
MaliA wrote:
Supermarket sales seem to be lower than expected across the board, so I am told.

You know the problem? Filthy poor people using food banks instead of contributing to our marvelous, booming economy. We should ban them.


If that were the case, I suspect Tesco, ASDA and Morrisons might suffer more than JS, M&S and Waitrose.

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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Tue Mar 07, 2017 12:43 
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Doctor Glyndwr wrote:
MaliA wrote:
Supermarket sales seem to be lower than expected across the board, so I am told.

You know the problem? Filthy poor people using food banks instead of contributing to our marvelous, booming economy. We should ban them.


Hmm, i just received new info contradictiny my view. Past quarter, year on year, all in growth, except one.

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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Tue Mar 07, 2017 12:46 
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Doctor Glyndwr wrote:
MaliA wrote:
Supermarket sales seem to be lower than expected across the board, so I am told.

You know the problem? Filthy poor people using food banks instead of contributing to our marvelous, booming economy. We should ban them.


Poor people or food banks?

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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Tue Mar 07, 2017 12:47 
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We should tax the use of food banks and give the proceeds to supermarkets, to make up for their lost business.


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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Tue Mar 07, 2017 12:50 
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devilman wrote:
Doctor Glyndwr wrote:
MaliA wrote:
Supermarket sales seem to be lower than expected across the board, so I am told.

You know the problem? Filthy poor people using food banks instead of contributing to our marvelous, booming economy. We should ban them.

Poor people or food banks?

Deliberately left ambiguous. I'm being a big-picture conservative. Implementation details can be left to others.


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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Tue Mar 07, 2017 13:14 
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Lonewolves wrote:
But the FTSE 250 doing as well as it was 3 years ago means we're all rich now surely?


Doctor Glyndwr wrote:
devilman wrote:
Doctor Glyndwr wrote:
MaliA wrote:
Supermarket sales seem to be lower than expected across the board, so I am told.

You know the problem? Filthy poor people using food banks instead of contributing to our marvelous, booming economy. We should ban them.

Poor people or food banks?

Deliberately left ambiguous. I'm being a big-picture conservative. Implementation details can be left to others.


This latest unprovoked trolling being directed at me, presumably? Again?

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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Tue Mar 07, 2017 13:16 
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Unprovoked :D

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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Tue Mar 07, 2017 13:24 
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OK then, how exactly have I provoked you personally, Myp? I'm seriously interested. Examples please.

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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Tue Mar 07, 2017 13:27 
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Cavey wrote:
OK then, how exactly have I provoked you personally, Myp? I'm seriously interested. Examples please.

I'm not attacking you personally. Grow a thicker skin!

I'm making fun of your bad opinions and poor data analysis

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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Tue Mar 07, 2017 13:30 
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Cavey wrote:
This latest unprovoked trolling being directed at me, presumably? Again?

It ain't all about you, snowflake.


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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Tue Mar 07, 2017 13:35 
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Lonewolves wrote:
Cavey wrote:
OK then, how exactly have I provoked you personally, Myp? I'm seriously interested. Examples please.

I'm not attacking you personally. Grow a thicker skin!

I'm making fun of your bad opinions and poor data analysis


Right, so actually it *is* unprovoked, because baiting someone deliberately, one-sidedly and obsessively for their "bad opinions" (i.e. you don't agree with them), when they are not even participating is trolling/bullying.

Glad we cleared that up.


Doctor Glyndwr wrote:
Cavey wrote:
This latest unprovoked trolling being directed at me, presumably? Again?

It ain't all about you, snowflake.


OK mods, I think this has gone quite far enough now. I'm never normally one to complain but I should be able to post/enjoy the forum without being obsessively followed around and trolled every day I am here. Enough.

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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Tue Mar 07, 2017 13:41 
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Dry your eyes son. Tell someone who gives a fuck. ;)

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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
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Lonewolves wrote:
Dry your eyes son. Tell someone who gives a fuck. ;)


He's not wrong. Argue the facts all you like but this is getting childish as all hell now

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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Tue Mar 07, 2017 13:48 
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Cras wrote:
Lonewolves wrote:
Dry your eyes son. Tell someone who gives a fuck. ;)


He's not wrong. Argue the facts all you like but this is getting childish as all hell now

So he can dish it out all he likes but goes crying to the mods as soon as it's given back the same way? Fair enough.

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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Tue Mar 07, 2017 13:50 
SupaMod
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Commander-in-Cheese

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Cavey makes the occasional comment and you (and Doc) throw them back in his face every single time he posts. It's ruining the politics threads, so put a sock in it, eh?

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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Tue Mar 07, 2017 13:52 
Awesome
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Cras wrote:
Cavey makes the occasional comment and you (and Doc) throw them back in his face every single time he posts. It's ruining the politics threads, so put a sock in it, eh?

Put this in blue text please.

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