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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Fri May 27, 2016 7:28 
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Paws for thought

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Malc wrote:
Quote:
if we kick out 2.2 million EU citizens, then that's most of the 2.7 million uk unemployed sorted...


I wasn't convinced, and it's a real shame that both sides haven't been more positive.

Yeah, that's just simplistic bullshit.


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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Fri May 27, 2016 8:58 
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I'm waiting for Leave to say 'vote Brexit for a proper, dark blue hard backed passport that makes you look like someone important, not that maroon EU floppy thing'. That might swing it for me.


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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Fri May 27, 2016 9:17 
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Fun Brexit Fact:

If we leave the EU, the Republic of Ireland will stil be in the EU.

There will still be open borders between RoI and NI, and between NI and England, as they're enshrined by the Good Friday Agreement.

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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Fri May 27, 2016 9:53 
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Curiosity wrote:
and between NI and England, as they're enshrined by the Good Friday Agreement.

But not Scotland?


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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Fri May 27, 2016 9:59 
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Curiosity wrote:
Fun Brexit Fact:

If we leave the EU, the Republic of Ireland will stil be in the EU.

There will still be open borders between RoI and NI, and between NI and England, as they're enshrined by the Good Friday Agreement.

Irrelevant. It's all covered by the CTA anyway: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Common_Travel_Area

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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Fri May 27, 2016 10:36 
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Lonewolves wrote:
Curiosity wrote:
Fun Brexit Fact:

If we leave the EU, the Republic of Ireland will stil be in the EU.

There will still be open borders between RoI and NI, and between NI and England, as they're enshrined by the Good Friday Agreement.

Irrelevant. It's all covered by the CTA anyway: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Common_Travel_Area

And the RoI isn't in Schengen, either, so doesn't have completely open borders with Europe.


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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Fri May 27, 2016 10:38 
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Lonewolves wrote:
Curiosity wrote:
Fun Brexit Fact:

If we leave the EU, the Republic of Ireland will stil be in the EU.

There will still be open borders between RoI and NI, and between NI and England, as they're enshrined by the Good Friday Agreement.

Irrelevant. It's all covered by the CTA anyway: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Common_Travel_Area


Well, if we exited the EU, you'd rather expect that we'd exit the CTA. But we kinda can't exit the Good Friday Agreement.

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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Fri May 27, 2016 10:43 
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Cras wrote:
Well, if we exited the EU, you'd rather expect that we'd exit the CTA.

Very unlikely. Why would you think that?

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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Fri May 27, 2016 10:44 
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Because the ROI has contingent free travel arrangements with the EU that we would no longer be part of.

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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Fri May 27, 2016 10:47 
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Cras wrote:
Because the ROI has contingent free travel arrangements with the EU that we would no longer be part of.

If we exit the CTA then you wouldn't be able to travel to the IOM or the Channel Islands freely. I would expect Ireland would have to exit the CTA if anything, considering they'd still be in the EU.

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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Fri May 27, 2016 11:00 
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Anyway, either way, leaving the EU will not make the country a right wing heaven of no immigration. Not that the Leave campaign has a single fucking clue what they would do if we did vote to leave, as all the various figures have utterly different and mutually exclusive plans, none of which are remotely feasible in reality.

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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Fri May 27, 2016 11:07 
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Should we be having some kind of sweepstake on the result of this?


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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Fri May 27, 2016 11:17 
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Lonewolves wrote:
Cras wrote:
Because the ROI has contingent free travel arrangements with the EU that we would no longer be part of.

If we exit the CTA then you wouldn't be able to travel to the IOM or the Channel Islands freely. I would expect Ireland would have to exit the CTA if anything, considering they'd still be in the EU.


With apologies to our Manx brethren, same difference.

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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Fri May 27, 2016 12:58 
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Cras wrote:
Lonewolves wrote:
Cras wrote:
Because the ROI has contingent free travel arrangements with the EU that we would no longer be part of.

If we exit the CTA then you wouldn't be able to travel to the IOM or the Channel Islands freely. I would expect Ireland would have to exit the CTA if anything, considering they'd still be in the EU.


With apologies to our Manx brethren, same difference.

What you mean is that you were highly likely to be technically incorrect?

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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Fri May 27, 2016 14:58 
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Oh dear.
BBC: Vote Leave launches £50m Euro 2016 football contest

Next week, they'll start building a giant wicker Manneken Pis for the MEPs we won't be needing.


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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Mon Jun 13, 2016 8:29 
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If you haven't decided yet, Antoine de Caunes and Jean Paul Gaultier will be on Channel 4 on Friday to help you choose.


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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Thu Jun 16, 2016 18:52 
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Anyway. I might be eligible for an Irish passport. unless having kids has fucked this

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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Thu Jun 16, 2016 18:54 
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I've been thinking about it since the days of Labour's ID Card scheme. I can drink Guinness and sing loudly in pubs, so I think I qualify.


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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Thu Jun 16, 2016 20:08 
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MaliA wrote:
Anyway. I might be eligible for an Irish passport. unless having kids has fucked this

About 10 people have asked me if I've applied for one yet. Despite my name, I don't qualify at all.


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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Thu Jun 16, 2016 20:26 
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ApplePieOfDestiny wrote:
MaliA wrote:
Anyway. I might be eligible for an Irish passport. unless having kids has fucked this

About 10 people have asked me if I've applied for one yet. Despite my name, I don't qualify at all.

Chris?


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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Thu Jun 16, 2016 20:31 
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Dickface?

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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Thu Jun 16, 2016 20:47 
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Cras wrote:
Dickface?

"Cunt Riley"

Genuine nickname


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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Fri Jun 17, 2016 8:35 
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ApplePieOfDestiny wrote:
Despite my name, I don't qualify at all.


I love it when colonials tell me they're proud of their Irish roots and decorate their pages on sinister Facebook with celtic patterns and slightly disturbing views on Anglo-Irish history. Usually it amounts to one great-grandfather who lived in Co. Tipperary in the 1870s.


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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Fri Jun 17, 2016 8:37 
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US colleague told me she had Irish and Scottish roots, said family was "probably from somewhere near the border between the two"

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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Fri Jun 17, 2016 8:40 
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Cras wrote:
US colleague told me she had Irish and Scottish roots, said family was "probably from somewhere near the border between the two"


Well, Scots were encouraged to populate the northern bit to bring in a bit of Protestantism, so she could be correct...


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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Fri Jun 17, 2016 8:40 
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Cras wrote:
US colleague told me she had Irish and Scottish roots, said family was "probably from somewhere near the border between the two"

:belm:


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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Fri Jun 17, 2016 12:19 
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Kern wrote:
ApplePieOfDestiny wrote:
Despite my name, I don't qualify at all.


I love it when colonials tell me they're proud of their Irish roots and decorate their pages on sinister Facebook with celtic patterns and slightly disturbing views on Anglo-Irish history. Usually it amounts to one great-grandfather who lived in Co. Tipperary in the 1870s.

Colonialism was good though

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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Fri Jun 17, 2016 13:12 
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Not in Roanoke.


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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Sat Jun 18, 2016 9:11 
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Leaflet watch: I finally got a 'Leave' one.


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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Sat Jun 18, 2016 11:09 
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Leaflet watch: I got a "make sure you vote" one, which was surprising.

Perhaps I should read it a bit closer.

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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Sat Jun 18, 2016 14:12 
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Leaflet watch: 50% off Dominos and a catalogue for stair lifts and disabled access bath tubs.

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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Sat Jun 18, 2016 18:06 
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Mimi wrote:
Leaflet watch: 50% off Dominos and a catalogue for stair lifts and disabled access bath tubs.

One follows the other


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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Sun Jun 19, 2016 15:49 
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Apparently, mail on Sunday are backing remain.

I expect to wake up from this frankly bizarre dream shortly.


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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Sun Jun 19, 2016 16:16 
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The Times is remain, the Sunday Times is leave. Trying to project some veneer of journalistic independence, perhaps?

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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Mon Jun 20, 2016 11:25 
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...Well, cometh the hour and all that, home straight now.
I don't know whether it is wishful thinking/hubris on my part, but I've always said that I just can't see the British people voting Brexit, and I stand by that. Nationalism has (generally) never found as fertile ground here like it has in mainland Europe; the "British sense of fair play" isn't entirely a product of fiction, and parties ranging from the National Front, EDL, BNP and UKIP haven't won a single parliamentary seat between them. When push comes to shove (SNP aside), and whatever the polls suggest, we always pull back from the brink. Unity and collaboration trumps spiteful isolation and myopic, delusions of grandeur induced selfishness.

Until quite recently, I thought Farage was a "lovable rogue" type character; okay, I didn't agree with his views (not least because of my Eastern European parentage, but also because I believe in unity and hope, not division and "othering"), but heck, I thought - I can share a pint and a smoke with the man, he seems jovial and "real" enough. Slowly, though, and for me at least, the mask has been slipping, the wolf in sheep's clothing has been ever more evident. The final straw? That poster Cras posted the other day, and the unbelievably close facsimile to Nazi material of the '30s... a dark warning from History indeed.

Come on UK, we're better than this. Let's show that grasping mop-haired twat and Kermit the dustbin of history once and for all.

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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Mon Jun 20, 2016 11:38 
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Cavey wrote:
...Well, cometh the hour and all that, home straight now.
I don't know whether it is wishful thinking/hubris on my part, but I've always said that I just can't see the British people voting Brexit, and I stand by that. Nationalism has (generally) never found as fertile ground here like it has in mainland Europe; the "British sense of fair play" isn't entirely a product of fiction, and parties ranging from the National Front, EDL, BNP and UKIP haven't won a single parliamentary seat between them. When push comes to shove (SNP aside), and whatever the polls suggest, we always pull back from the brink. Unity and collaboration trumps spiteful isolation and myopic, delusions of grandeur induced selfishness.

Until quite recently, I thought Farage was a "lovable rogue" type character; okay, I didn't agree with his views (not least because of my Eastern European parentage, but also because I believe in unity and hope, not division and "othering"), but heck, I thought - I can share a pint and a smoke with the man, he seems jovial and "real" enough. Slowly, though, and for me at least, the mask has been slipping, the wolf in sheep's clothing has been ever more evident. The final straw? That poster Cras posted the other day, and the unbelievably close facsimile to Nazi material of the '30s... a dark warning from History indeed.

Come on UK, we're better than this. Let's show that grasping mop-haired twat and Kermit the dustbin of history.


I have to admit, losing the will to live a few of my friends who keep saying UKIP is not racist, as they have non-white party supporters......

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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Mon Jun 20, 2016 11:48 
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Yes I know Kov, I get the same crap too, and whilst easily rebutted it does beg the question: are some of my friends really that stupid?

I have to believe that in the end, the facts of the situation will win through. I do, however, deplore the shitness of the Remain campaign; Corbyn doesn't even believe it and his disingenuous, lukewarm and heavily caveated platitudes reek of "I don't actually believe this stuff", and Cameron and Osborne are almost as badly damaged goods. I'd have liked to have seen a lot more from the BoE, CBI and the Unions for one, but we are where we are I guess.

I hate to say this but I think Jo Cox' murder is a watershed moment; people are thinking, this fantastic young woman spoke for unity and everyone, and was a bulwark against small-minded hatred. 'Can I really vote with the people she so vehemently opposed, as amply evidenced by *that* poster with Farage sat in front of it'? People need to remember where that shit leads!

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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Mon Jun 20, 2016 11:52 
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I don't believe that most people are that stupid. I think people who argue that Farage isn't racist don't believe a word they are saying. It's like a nudge nudge wink wink thing between him and his supporters. Fuck all of them frankly.


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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Mon Jun 20, 2016 11:53 
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Cavey wrote:
I do, however, deplore the shitness of the Remain campaign;


Excluding all the 'fear and loathing across the Isles' stuff, the on-going lack of positivity for the EU as it is hasn't been helping the stay side. It often comes down to 'yes, the EU's generally crap and we'd wish they'd stop doing stuff but it's better than the alternative', which isn't that inspiring. On the other hand, I guess having a few proper federalists speak to the public might be really off-putting.


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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Mon Jun 20, 2016 12:06 
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Cavey wrote:
parties ranging from the National Front, EDL, BNP and UKIP haven't won a single parliamentary seat between them.
UKIP won Clacton with Douglas Carswell after he defected from the Conservatives. The other organisations are rather more... overt... about what they stand for, whereas UKIP (to my mind) didn't start out to be racist; it just realised early on that it could pick up easy votes via dogwhistle politics. Also: UKIP took 13% of the popular vote last year. That ain't nothing. Under PR, it would give them 80-odd seats.

Quote:
Until quite recently, I thought Farage was a "lovable rogue" type character; okay, I didn't agree with his views (not least because of my Eastern European parentage, but also because I believe in unity and hope, not division and "othering"), but heck, I thought - I can share a pint and a smoke with the man, he seems jovial and "real" enough. Slowly, though, and for me at least, the mask has been slipping, the wolf in sheep's clothing has been ever more evident. The final straw? That poster Cras posted the other day, and the unbelievably close facsimile to Nazi material of the '30s... a dark warning from History indeed.
Well, quite. We did try to tell you man :)


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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Mon Jun 20, 2016 12:14 
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markg wrote:
I don't believe that most people are that stupid. I think people who argue that Farage isn't racist don't believe a word they are saying. It's like a nudge nudge wink wink thing between him and his supporters. Fuck all of them frankly.

I was somewhat surprised by Baroness Warsi's decision to flip from Leave to Remain in response to Farage's racist poster.

Did she really think he wasn't racist prior to seeing that poster? What were her reasons for siding with Leave in the first place? Did Farage's racist poster cause all those reasons to evaporate?


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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Mon Jun 20, 2016 12:18 
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I'm more inclined to think she saw which way the wind was blowing. Wars is nothing if not a politician to the core.

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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Mon Jun 20, 2016 12:19 
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Warsi is just opportunistic. She was a very quiet Brexit person who has seen that the wind has changed and is looking for a 'reward' for creating bad press for Leave.

I now think we'll probably just squeak a remain vote. But a lot will depend on turnout, as those voting IN are the less likely voters (and apparently the less likely to be polled also).

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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Mon Jun 20, 2016 12:19 
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o/

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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Mon Jun 20, 2016 12:21 
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Curiosity wrote:
o/


\o

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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Mon Jun 20, 2016 12:27 
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SavyGamer

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Aye, my intention was to make that point rhetorically.


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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Mon Jun 20, 2016 13:58 
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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Mon Jun 20, 2016 14:58 
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What's wrong with an EU Army? Why should I be terrified by it?

(Plus, UK has Veto, so it can say no, right?)

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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Mon Jun 20, 2016 15:01 
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Pod wrote:
What's wrong with an EU Army? Why should I be terrified by it?
It's perceived as another substantial by the EU powers-that-be towards a fully federal Europe, seeing as how "having an army" is one of the defining traits of statehood. "Terrified" is likely overstating it, although it's something I could convince myself to feel uneasy about, personally.


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 Post subject: Re: Taking the Brexit
PostPosted: Mon Jun 20, 2016 17:40 
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That John Oliver clip is excellent.


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