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 Post subject: Re: Gamersgate
PostPosted: Thu Oct 23, 2014 12:19 
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flis wrote:
The understanding I have of it, from the limited time I've spent trying to understand what's going on, is

mostly wrong, sadly.

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 Post subject: Re: Gamersgate
PostPosted: Thu Oct 23, 2014 12:20 
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ElephantBanjoGnome are you deliberately trolling here? Not far up the thread you state you have no idea about how this all started, was it something to do with a woman sleeping around? Now you know that "There are plenty of 'gamergaters' that are trying to uphold a perfectly legitimate view that in no way is associated with the constant accusations of misogyny. "

If your even vaguely interested in the start of this whole mess -a forbes article but it hits all the high points and save trawling through barrels of shit.


Regardless they are associated with a new 'movement' which have used vile and illegal methods to target people who disagree with their views, since this has been going on from day on of the Gamersgate saga then yes it is hard not to tar them all with the same brush, the whole group hide behind the shield of silence created by the vile actions of the few. They are complicit by not speaking out against these actions.

Many leading figure in the Muslim community are very vocal in denouncing the acts of extremists. Trying to link gamersgate to a ancient religion just seems pathetic to me, but keep on banging your drum if that makes you happy.

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 Post subject: Re: Gamersgate
PostPosted: Thu Oct 23, 2014 12:23 
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ElephantBanjoGnome wrote:
Incidentally - a person makes a post and gets 'doxxed' by an individual dickhead, and the outraged world is happy to condemn the whole movement. Is this so radically different from extremist muslims giving the rest of them a bad name? People go to great lengths to point out how an individual action that alleges support to a given ideology is NOT representative.

The court of public opinion is just so self-evidently hypocritical when applying its logic on who to righteously damn in these situations.


Not the same.

If you think ethics in gaming journalism needs a voice, find one you believe in. Go your separate ways. There are loads of political parties, mostly all wanting the same sort of thing and some are more extreme about their wants and how they go about it.

The majority of Muslims do not affiliate themselves with radical hate groups; if they were to, people would assume they believe in what ISIS stands for.

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 Post subject: Re: Gamersgate
PostPosted: Thu Oct 23, 2014 12:27 
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American Nervoso wrote:
EBG - it is worrying how little you know about a subject yet how forcefully you will argue your misinformed twaddle. Stop now lest you make yourself look very foolish (and not for the first time).

Scrunch up concentration here, peon-brain, because this isn't very hard to understand. I'm talking about the aspersions and wide generalisations that are applied to opposing sides in a basic argument. The parties of these two sides could be anyone - gamergate vs. feminists. islam vs. the world - the actual subject doesn't matter here because I'm calling upon you to examine how trivially you determine the evil of the side you disagree with.

Slightly Green - this applies for you too. I know nothing about the motivations of individual games people. I know some of them allege legitimacy, and that's sufficient for the purposes of this comparative argument.

No need to ask who myp supports here, and yet has no perception of just how blindly and aggressive he is in that opinion. There is no examination, or concession, to the other motivations of the people who support the movement for reasons other than 'misogyny'. It's all evil, right from the start, there's no wiggle room, there's no justification. I'm right, you're wrong!!!11

And then tries to uphold that as the rationale argument and casting me, who isn't supporting either side specifically because I don't know enough about it, as the one spouting nonsense. It's quite the spectacle.

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 Post subject: Re: Gamersgate
PostPosted: Thu Oct 23, 2014 12:29 
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Now I noticed that this stupid movement has the same name as Paradox online store. Talk about negative publicity....


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 Post subject: Re: Gamersgate
PostPosted: Thu Oct 23, 2014 12:30 
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American Nervoso wrote:
flis wrote:
The understanding I have of it, from the limited time I've spent trying to understand what's going on, is

mostly wrong, sadly.


This is why I find it tiresome... Lots of comments like this but none expanding on what the issues are or how that understanding of it is mostly wrong.

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 Post subject: Re: Gamersgate
PostPosted: Thu Oct 23, 2014 12:34 
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flis wrote:
American Nervoso wrote:
flis wrote:
The understanding I have of it, from the limited time I've spent trying to understand what's going on, is

mostly wrong, sadly.


This is why I find it tiresome... Lots of comments like this but none expanding on what the issues are or how that understanding of it is mostly wrong.

Because it's too tiresome to explain to everyone who asks while you are busy fighting it. If you are really interested in what's going on then do some reading - there are hundreds of articles on the topic.

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 Post subject: Re: Gamersgate
PostPosted: Thu Oct 23, 2014 12:36 
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I think everyone accepts that there are a lot of misguided people who don't want to be active arseholes who are a part of GG. Fighting against corruption in the gaming industry is obviously a noble goal.

However, unwittingly or not, they are at best like the guy asking for money without the gun in the above cartoon.

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 Post subject: Re: Gamersgate
PostPosted: Thu Oct 23, 2014 12:40 
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ElephantBanjoGnome wrote:
gamergate vs. feminists


So it is only against feminists? I see it as not against feminism but against human decency, seriously regardless of your view point, death threats and much of the other vile behaviour is just plain wrong. The way you seem to be viewing it as a anti-feminist battle should maybe make you look more in the mirror at your own personal beliefs.

I honestly think both sides have valid points but that is lost in the backwash of crazy that overshadows the whole issue.

Quote:
#GamerGate isn’t about conspiracies. It isn’t about scandal and corruption. It isn’t about feminists or misogynists. It isn’t about any of these things, and it’s about all of them all at once.

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 Post subject: Re: Gamersgate
PostPosted: Thu Oct 23, 2014 12:55 
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Slightly Green wrote:
So it is only against feminists?

I don't need to examine any beliefs here because I'm not coming in on one side or the other. My point is that it doesn't matter who the second side is - it could be anyone. I'm not actually talking about the specifics of this particular argument, as I've said more than once. Sheesh.

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 Post subject: Re: Gamersgate
PostPosted: Thu Oct 23, 2014 13:05 
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I still don't see why corruption in the games industry is such a big issue for normal punters that they are getting so riled up about it. It's that which leads me to tend towards agreeing with the view that it's likely a pretext for something else.


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 Post subject: Re: Gamersgate
PostPosted: Thu Oct 23, 2014 13:23 
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Vote GamerGate! To align yourself with glittering geniuses like this one:

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Because women playing Candy Crush are committing "cultural appropriation."


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 Post subject: Re: Gamersgate
PostPosted: Thu Oct 23, 2014 13:30 
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markg wrote:
I still don't see why corruption in the games industry is such a big issue for normal punters that they are getting so riled up about it. It's that which leads me to tend towards agreeing with the view that it's likely a pretext for something else.

Well, we could compile a "history of games ethics scandals that didn't make everyone lose their shit"; it would include that time Your Sinclair had to buy tapes from shops because they didn't get review copies from (IIRC) Ocean; Doritosgate; the time Jeff Gerstmann was actually fired for giving Kane & Lynch 6/10, or Steve Hogarty's review of The Sims: Ikea expansion.

But no. All those moments passed, like tears in rain. And yet this time, the time that focused a woman game developer who hadn't actually done anything wrong and a woman game critic who also hasn't done anything wrong, this time seems to be the last straw for an army of people who have now been booted from 4chan for being too vile, if you could imagine such a thing. But I'm sure the misogyny angle is just a red herring.


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 Post subject: Re: Gamersgate
PostPosted: Thu Oct 23, 2014 13:35 
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Doctor Glyndwr wrote:
But no. All those moments passed, like tears in rain. And yet this time, the time that focused a woman game developer who hadn't actually done anything wrong and a woman game critic who also hasn't done anything wrong, this time seems to be the last straw for an army of people who have now been booted from 4chan for being too vile, if you could imagine such a thing. But I'm sure the misogyny angle is just a red herring.


Your also missing out on the questionable ethical stance taken in the last month with Warner Brothers and Shadow of Mordor

http://www.forbes.com/sites/erikkain/20 ... p-in-arms/


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 Post subject: Re: Gamersgate
PostPosted: Thu Oct 23, 2014 13:39 
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I liked Chris Kluwe's take:

Quote:
Thus, when I see an article titled “Gamers are dead,” referring to the death of the popular trope of a pasty young man in a dimly lit room, it fills me with joy, because it means WE FUCKING WON. So many people are playing games now that they are popular culture. They are not going away. All sorts of cool things, that I like, are now things that a whole bunch of other people like! There’s enough space now for people to make games that are strange and disturbing and maybe highlight a different perspective of the world, because gaming is no longer a niche activity, it’s something that everybody does. There is room for art in video games. That’s awesome!

You slopebrowed weaseldicks with zero reading comprehension and even less critical thinking skills who think an article claiming “Gamers are dead” is something bad? Fuck me sideways with a sandblaster.

It’s like all you can do is look at this collection of words, scratch yourself uneasily, and then run off to look for grubs. Your reaction (and I am not making this up, because it’s been widely documented literally everywhere) to various articles proclaiming the death of the basement-dwelling, cheetos-huffing, poopsock-sniffing douchepistol, because games are so good now that they are common entertainment and thus everyone plays them, was to COMPLETELY MISS THE POINT by either:

a) Making misogynistic threats against a wide variety of female game developers and critics because somehow they’re going to keep games you enjoy from ever being made again

or

b) Being stupid enough to get sucked in by people busy making misogynistic threats against a wide variety of female game developers and critics, and supporting their idiotic crusade for the dumbing down of everyone everywhere ever.

Every time I see one of you slackjawed pickletits link me something like “I’m a moderate #Gamergate’r,” or “#Gamergate in sixty seconds YOUTUBE CLIP,” or “Here’s an anecdotal story from this one woman we found that completely negates an entire history of misogyny and abuse of women, not just in videogaming but in the entirety of human existence so support the REAL GAMERS,” it pisses me the fuck off because you are ruining something I enjoy. When people — everyday people who watch the coverage on CNN of Anita Sarkeesian having to cancel a speaking engagement due to death threats — think of “gamers,” they are going to think of you, and that irritates me. It enrages me. I want to punch down a wall, and I like my walls. They’re nicely painted.


Quote:
In fact, #Gamergaters, if your concern really was ethics, the very first thing you would be saying about this whole mess is, “Holy shit, get these fucking misogynistic creeps away from us. Let’s find a different hashtag to assemble under RIGHT FUCKING NOW.” You’d be doing everything in your power to make sure the legitimate cause you’re concerned about wasn’t hijacked or used as a shield by those with no other agenda than to make women and minorities afraid, simply because they can. You wouldn’t defend the oppression of someone simply based on their gender (because let’s be real honest here, I haven’t seen a single #Gamergater go after Activision, or Ubisoft, or Rockstar), and you definitely wouldn’t concoct ever-more wild conspiracy theories to support your increasingly flawed view of reality.

(My personal favorite is that a combination of a secret cabal of power-mad journalists are working with the world-threatening feminist agenda in order to remove the purity of video games, because Obama and Jews. That’s a good look, people. Very convincing. I’m surprised you couldn’t work chemtrails in there somehow.)


His point about no 'gater going after big firms is well-made. During all of this, it emerged that YouTubers had traded access to review copies of Shadows of Mordor in return for a contract that said they couldn't say anything bad about it. Surely a bit of dodgy ethics the gamergate mob seized upon, right? Well, no. Barely a squeak. The bile and outrage is reserved exclusively for women and indie game makers. Why? Read Kluwe's rant.


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 Post subject: Re: Gamersgate
PostPosted: Thu Oct 23, 2014 13:39 
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zaphod79 wrote:
Your also missing out on the questionable ethical stance taken in the last month with Warner Brothers and Shadow of Mordor

http://www.forbes.com/sites/erikkain/20 ... p-in-arms/

Heh, you're right, I was (but just posted about it while you were writing that.)


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 Post subject: Re: Gamersgate
PostPosted: Thu Oct 23, 2014 13:41 
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Incidentally, Kluwe wrote that two days ago. Nothing has happened, no-one has threatened to hurt him (might help that he's a 6'4" professional NFL player). Felicia Day wrote a very carefully worded piece where she said nothing bad about GamerGate other than that the whole thing upset her. Someone posted her home address in the comments of her own blog within the hour.

But it's not about women, right?


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 Post subject: Re: Gamersgate
PostPosted: Thu Oct 23, 2014 13:48 
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I think you need to white knight harder, Gaywood, there are powerless, impotent women out there that rely on your snarky link-quoting on this forum for their ongoing self-esteem.

/s

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 Post subject: Re: Gamersgate
PostPosted: Thu Oct 23, 2014 13:55 
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ElephantBanjoGnome wrote:
white knight


You're off message there man, the new way of offering this kind of non-response is to call someone an 'SJW'.


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 Post subject: Re: Gamersgate
PostPosted: Thu Oct 23, 2014 13:55 
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I see Gnomes has posted something I fortunately cannot see. Working blind, I'm going to take a guess at: hmmm; https://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/ad-hominem


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 Post subject: Re: Gamersgate
PostPosted: Thu Oct 23, 2014 13:56 
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Doctor Glyndwr wrote:
Incidentally, Kluwe wrote that two days ago. Nothing has happened, no-one has threatened to hurt him (might help that he's a 6'4" professional NFL player). Felicia Day wrote a very carefully worded piece where she said nothing bad about GamerGate other than that the whole thing upset her. Someone posted her home address in the comments of her own blog within the hour.

But it's not about women, right?

How many times are we going to mention that?

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 Post subject: Re: Gamersgate
PostPosted: Thu Oct 23, 2014 13:57 
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Richard Yaywood!

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 Post subject: Re: Gamersgate
PostPosted: Thu Oct 23, 2014 13:57 
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Doctor Glyndwr wrote:
I see Gnomes has posted something I fortunately cannot see. Working blind, I'm going to take a guess at: hmmm; https://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/ad-hominem

Oh my, that's perfect.

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 Post subject: Re: Gamersgate
PostPosted: Thu Oct 23, 2014 13:57 
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Doctor Glyndwr wrote:
I see Gnomes has posted something I fortunately cannot see.


There's a slight flaw in the super-ignore feature that I'm too weak to not exploit sometimes. I am my own worst enemy. :(


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 Post subject: Re: Gamersgate
PostPosted: Thu Oct 23, 2014 13:58 
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ElephantBanjoGnome wrote:
I think you need to white knight harder


That's great. Because any attempt to suggest that rape and death threats are a bad thing is clearly 'white-knighting' and not just being 'not-a-cunt'.

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 Post subject: Re: Gamersgate
PostPosted: Thu Oct 23, 2014 13:58 
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Bamba wrote:
Doctor Glyndwr wrote:
I see Gnomes has posted something I fortunately cannot see.


There's a slight flaw in the super-ignore feature that I'm too weak to not exploit sometimes. I am my own worst enemy. :(

O RLY?

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 Post subject: Re: Gamersgate
PostPosted: Thu Oct 23, 2014 13:59 
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Just out of curiosity, how do you super ignore someone?

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 Post subject: Re: Gamersgate
PostPosted: Thu Oct 23, 2014 14:01 
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This page:
ucp.php?i=zebra&mode=foes

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 Post subject: Re: Gamersgate
PostPosted: Thu Oct 23, 2014 14:01 
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Grim... wrote:
Bamba wrote:
Doctor Glyndwr wrote:
I see Gnomes has posted something I fortunately cannot see.


There's a slight flaw in the super-ignore feature that I'm too weak to not exploit sometimes. I am my own worst enemy. :(

O RLY?


When you're on the screen with the reply box (proper reply, not quick reply) the last however many posts of the thread are given below so you can review them and that view doesn't ignore your ignorees. I'm genuinely not mentioning it to moan about it or anything, just to acknowledge how much of a tit I am in sometimes looking at it.


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 Post subject: Re: Gamersgate
PostPosted: Thu Oct 23, 2014 14:02 
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CODE TIME

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 Post subject: Re: Gamersgate
PostPosted: Thu Oct 23, 2014 14:02 
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Grim... wrote:


Thanks

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 Post subject: Re: Gamersgate
PostPosted: Thu Oct 23, 2014 14:03 
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Doctor Glyndwr wrote:
I see Gnomes has posted something I fortunately cannot see. Working blind, I'm going to take a guess at: hmmm; https://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/ad-hominem

What a transparent nonsense, Gaywood. I have made many posts in this thread and you never speculated on what I might have said without being to see it before, and yet this time you psychically assume it's directed at you? Coincidental indeed.

I wouldn't mind so much if most of these posts weren't the self-righteous, self-congratulatory reinforcement of a belief in the comfortable environment where nobody is actually disagreeing with you. Do you think you're furthering the cause by bravely battling against these trolls in a place where they don't exist, and making it clear to others who already agree with you in principle about just how right you are? You're not promoting debate, or discussion, you're just smarming into an echo-chamber.

Gaywood's tactic [ed] still hasn't changed, and rather than have the wherewithal to come up with anything new, he just link-quotes others along with a snarky one-liner and thinks he's done a really effective job of making his point. It's.... sad. But since he definitely hasn't read this he's safe from my criticism.

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 Post subject: Re: Gamersgate
PostPosted: Thu Oct 23, 2014 14:03 
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Tack.

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 Post subject: Re: Gamersgate
PostPosted: Thu Oct 23, 2014 14:04 
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Cras wrote:
Tack.

Mac.

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 Post subject: Re: Gamersgate
PostPosted: Thu Oct 23, 2014 14:06 
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Cras wrote:
Because any attempt to suggest that rape and death threats are a bad thing is clearly 'white-knighting' and not just being 'not-a-cunt'.

Come on Craster, you're smarter than that. You know that the tone and method of what you say makes a difference, and to criticise that is not the implicit support of 'rape and death threats'. That's the kind of simplistic reductionism used to stifle any form of discussion around the subject.

I'd hope this was obvious despite the emboldened /s that I very deliberately put there.

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 Post subject: Re: Gamersgate
PostPosted: Thu Oct 23, 2014 14:07 
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Yeah, you might have to explain that a little.

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 Post subject: Re: Gamersgate
PostPosted: Thu Oct 23, 2014 14:12 
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ElephantBanjoGnome wrote:
Cras wrote:
Because any attempt to suggest that rape and death threats are a bad thing is clearly 'white-knighting' and not just being 'not-a-cunt'.

Come on Craster, you're smarter than that. You know that the tone and method of what you say makes a difference, and to criticise that is not the implicit support of 'rape and death threats'. That's the kind of simplistic reductionism used to stifle any form of discussion around the subject..


The problem is that you actually haven't done much paying attention to what's being going on, and that's very much clear in what you're posting. It's not reductionism. It's what's happening. GG has no online campaign that isn't harrassment. Every single move they make is either threats and hounding of a female reporter/games industry person/personality or it's a harrassment campaign aimed at intimidating media outlets and getting advertisers to pull their funding.
You keep talking about GG as if it's a movement with a few bad eggs. It really isn't! From the very start the whole thing was malicious and had no goals compatible with being a decent human being.

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 Post subject: Re: Gamersgate
PostPosted: Thu Oct 23, 2014 14:31 
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Cras wrote:
You keep talking about GG as if it's a movement with a few bad eggs. It really isn't! From the very start the whole thing was malicious and had no goals compatible with being a decent human being.

For the 7th time, I'm not trying to allege in-depth knowledge of who has said what to whom here. I haven't said anything about the specific accusations. To repeat myself tediously, I am tackling less of this subject and more of the general tendency to vilify the entirety of a movement based on the actions of individuals. Absolute guilt by association with no acknowledgement that it's rarely so simple.

I'll say again, this is not confined to this single issue. Note that I am not specifically talking about GamerGate. I've said it before, but let me just repeat that again for clarity - I am talking about a general point. Am I making this clear? Could I just take a moment to reiterate that I'm talking about the nature of opposing views rather than the specific nature of this particular dispute? Perhaps I need to say it in a different way again to make that understood.

To me it's as stupid as saying 'All UKIP supporters are racists'. They're clearly not, and that's a stupid opinion to hold if you truly believe it. It's merely a political force that you disagree with and it's expedient to take the highly-publicised actions of a few to negate the entire movement for your own political ends.

Now regardless of whether you believe that their core message, or the majority of their supporters are proponents of basic racism, you must concede that there are many within it that vociferously do not believe that and uphold different views. Those people exist.

Now, you might believe that GamerGate is full of hateful misogynists, and the volume of evidence might support that - at least as far as you're concerned (I have no opinion). But there inarguably exist those that don't uphold that, but you're insisting there's no other possible interpretation for anyone who might have something to say about the legitimacy of games journalism under that banner, misguided or otherwise.

It would seem fairly minor concession to accept that those people exist and are not participating in women-hating harassment, but the comments in here don't seem able to do that. I don't support UKIP, but I can say what I've said and know that it's true, and that it's not black and white. The same is true here except it's clearly not BECAUSE THEY'RE OBVIOUSLY EVIL. These kinds of absolutes are just intellectually simplistic. You'd all seem more credible if you merely qualified with the appropriate, reasonable caveats.

Instead it's link quoting and self-back-slapping 'hurr hurr look it's clearly misogyny' drivel.

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 Post subject: Re: Gamersgate
PostPosted: Thu Oct 23, 2014 14:33 
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The Onion: A Summary Of The Gamergate Movement That We Will Immediately Change If Any Of Its Members Find Any Details Objectionable

Gater: "#GamerGate #notyourshield It's telling when @TheOnion writes a better article than the mainstream media"

Gater: "Satire website making fun of the people thinking #GamerGate is sexist? You got it. Thank you @ClickHole"


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 Post subject: Re: Gamersgate
PostPosted: Thu Oct 23, 2014 14:53 
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That reminds me: can someone explain the #notyourshield thing? I've read a few explanation and it just twists my brain somehow.


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 Post subject: Re: Gamersgate
PostPosted: Thu Oct 23, 2014 14:57 
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Bamba wrote:
That reminds me: can someone explain the #notyourshield thing? I've read a few explanation and it just twists my brain somehow.

http://arstechnica.com/gaming/2014/09/n ... spotlight/

Quote:
As for #notyourshield, its first reference appears on the /v/ video games board on 4chan as a suggestion for responding to "social justice warriors" who claimed the #GamerGate campaign was misogynistic. "Something like #NotYourShield and demand the SJWs stop using you as a shield to deflect genuine criticism," an anonymous user wrote on September 2

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 Post subject: Re: Gamersgate
PostPosted: Thu Oct 23, 2014 15:04 
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American Nervoso wrote:
Bamba wrote:
That reminds me: can someone explain the #notyourshield thing? I've read a few explanation and it just twists my brain somehow.

http://arstechnica.com/gaming/2014/09/n ... spotlight/

Quote:
As for #notyourshield, its first reference appears on the /v/ video games board on 4chan as a suggestion for responding to "social justice warriors" who claimed the #GamerGate campaign was misogynistic. "Something like #NotYourShield and demand the SJWs stop using you as a shield to deflect genuine criticism," an anonymous user wrote on September 2


The part I'm still not clear on is who exactly is it alleging is being used as a shield? And against what? So, yeah, I'm still not clear on any of it!


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 Post subject: Re: Gamersgate
PostPosted: Thu Oct 23, 2014 15:10 
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It's a weird choice of name fr something that was the equivalent of saying, "I CAN'T BE RACIST! I HAVE A BLACK FRIEND!"

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 Post subject: Re: Gamersgate
PostPosted: Thu Oct 23, 2014 15:12 
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Bamba wrote:
American Nervoso wrote:
Bamba wrote:
That reminds me: can someone explain the #notyourshield thing? I've read a few explanation and it just twists my brain somehow.

http://arstechnica.com/gaming/2014/09/n ... spotlight/

Quote:
As for #notyourshield, its first reference appears on the /v/ video games board on 4chan as a suggestion for responding to "social justice warriors" who claimed the #GamerGate campaign was misogynistic. "Something like #NotYourShield and demand the SJWs stop using you as a shield to deflect genuine criticism," an anonymous user wrote on September 2


The part I'm still not clear on is who exactly is it alleging is being used as a shield? And against what? So, yeah, I'm still not clear on any of it!

That's because it's inherently nonsensical. The important thing that it was a red herring created by GG'rs in order to discredit people who were calling them misogynistic.

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 Post subject: Re: Gamersgate
PostPosted: Thu Oct 23, 2014 15:16 
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ElephantBanjoGnome wrote:
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You keep talking about GG as if it's a movement with a few bad eggs. It really isn't! From the very start the whole thing was malicious and had no goals compatible with being a decent human being.

For the 7th time, I'm not trying to allege in-depth knowledge of who has said what to whom here. I haven't said anything about the specific accusations. To repeat myself tediously, I am tackling less of this subject and more of the general tendency to vilify the entirety of a movement based on the actions of individuals. Absolute guilt by association with no acknowledgement that it's rarely so simple.

I'll say again, this is not confined to this single issue. Note that I am not specifically talking about GamerGate. I've said it before, but let me just repeat that again for clarity - I am talking about a general point. Am I making this clear? Could I just take a moment to reiterate that I'm talking about the nature of opposing views rather than the specific nature of this particular dispute? Perhaps I need to say it in a different way again to make that understood.


Right, and that is my entire point. You're saying 'this isn't about these guys, it's about saying something bad about X amount of people because of a few individuals'. And what I'm saying back is that your point is a total irrelevancy in this conversation. Nobody here is painting an entire movement because of the actions of a few individuals. Because it's not a few individuals - it's the vast majority. And the entire movement is entirely based on malicious action rooted in falsehood and mysogeny.

So if your argument is "I want to talk about this general principle", there's no point being in this thread, because that principle that you've decided to champion really doesn't apply here, as a small amount of background reading would show.

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 Post subject: Re: Gamersgate
PostPosted: Thu Oct 23, 2014 15:17 
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American Nervoso wrote:
Bamba wrote:
American Nervoso wrote:
Bamba wrote:
That reminds me: can someone explain the #notyourshield thing? I've read a few explanation and it just twists my brain somehow.

http://arstechnica.com/gaming/2014/09/n ... spotlight/

Quote:
As for #notyourshield, its first reference appears on the /v/ video games board on 4chan as a suggestion for responding to "social justice warriors" who claimed the #GamerGate campaign was misogynistic. "Something like #NotYourShield and demand the SJWs stop using you as a shield to deflect genuine criticism," an anonymous user wrote on September 2


The part I'm still not clear on is who exactly is it alleging is being used as a shield? And against what? So, yeah, I'm still not clear on any of it!

That's because it's inherently nonsensical.


Thank God for that; I was beginning to worry I'd gone mad.

I did actually read a few articles since my last post and there's a genuine core of the entire concept that just seems bonkers even if you look at it from the GG side. It's a tag that female gamers should use to say to anti-GG people that they don't want to be used as an excuse by the anti-GG side to tell the GG side to stop being horrible about women. Have I really read all that right? 8)


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 Post subject: Re: Gamersgate
PostPosted: Thu Oct 23, 2014 15:19 
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That's exactly right. It was some bizarre idea with a rough parallel to the meat packing industry trying to start a campaign by chickens against vegetarians.

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 Post subject: Re: Gamersgate
PostPosted: Thu Oct 23, 2014 16:59 
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 Post subject: Re: Gamersgate
PostPosted: Thu Oct 23, 2014 17:14 
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Well, John Scalzi might just be my new hero.

http://whatever.scalzi.com/2014/10/23/h ... oycott-me/

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 Post subject: Re: Gamersgate
PostPosted: Thu Oct 23, 2014 17:19 
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Heh, and that linked to this.


Last edited by Grim... on Thu Oct 23, 2014 18:06, edited 1 time in total.
Fixed the monster URL


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