Be Excellent To Each Other

(From Private Eye last week)

Cameron is on the news having "his own debate" with some factory workers in Leeds right now.

Tonight should be interesting and it might turn out to be a polling mistake for Cameron and Clegg not to have been present.

At least he is being asked some real questions about food bank usage, right to buy, child care, inheritance tax etc.

3 weeks to go!

Did anyone watch it last night? I didn't, and from what I've heard on the news I don't think I missed much.

I did, it was pretty boring, so I wandered out the room halfway through.

I watched it, it was more lively than the 7 way debate.

It's on Iplayer if you want to watch / listen to it whilst doing something else.

I watched about 10 minutes. It exemplified children arguing amongst themselves while the parent was off doing something else.

Very bored of the pseudo-socialist crowd-pleasing bollocks that demonizes those successful enough to be a buy to let investor. How fucking dare they, in a capitalist society! Clearly the answer is just to tax the rich 100% of all their money and give it to the poor. Go Socialism! Zzzzz.

You can't generalise about the poor because that's ignorant. In the next breath all buy to let landlords are evil scum because they charge too much for rent and some of them just let the houses sit there and accumulate value! Something something 'for the families of this country and their children, in our country, the children, prosperity, children, blahblah fucking blah'.

Christ, let's just get this shit show over with already. Everyone is full of shit, each with their own dickheads that just lap it up like gospel.

I saw Galloway in his stupid white bus on my way home. Stupid twats.

With 19 days to go, for me it boils down to this:

Dont let the Conservatives get in again.

National Debt 2010 £750b
National Debt 2015 £1500b
National Debt 2020 ?

Ukip have a dog in the Shipley fight. Not clear if he is a swivel eye or a loon, though. Labour candidate dies not even have an office. Will probably vote Green due to the Tory is a twats, and the Labour bloke seemingly cannot be arsed. The Green party candidate has sent a flyer through at least.

What the fucking elephant bollocks?



Hey look at that ENORMOUS FUCKING SPIKE in net borrowing between 2007-10 when Labour were off their tits borrowing and spending on all sorts of ridiculous shit. But even though the Tories can't reverse the enormous fuck-up of Labour in 5 years during a massive recession we'd better not let them keep trying. More borrowing! More tax breaks! Gimmie Gimmie Gimmie!

Unless you're one of those numpty fruitcakes that thinks we can borrow our way to prosperity, because it worked so well under Labour. You fucking people, honestly.

I'm no fan of Brown, but 2007 to 2010 was a recession. Tax intake and gdp went downhill severely, so it's hardly surprising that borrowing as a percentage of GDP went up sharply. Simple maths. The charitable interpretation is that the borrowing was to keep stuff going, not additional spending on "ridiculous shit".

EBG - your graph shows the amount added to the national debt per year. As such, and only then as a ratio. The actual national debt is still growing at all times. It's just growing by less at this point (as a percentage of GDP) than it was before AUSTERITY FUN kicked in.

Also, the projected move to positive by the end of next parliament has been thoroughly criticised by most observers as being unrealistic.

UKIP will get 4 seats. Greens 2. More when I think about it.

Looks like someone doesnt understand the difference between a deficit and a debt.

And as for the name calling, I'm not a 'numpty fruitcake'.

Did my post say anything about the debt decreasing under the Tories? I even said 'Net borrowing', not mentioning the national debt figure once. Clearly the best first step to actually tackling it is getting the deficit to zero, or preferably a surplus.

Christ, I hate to think what that graph would have looked like under another 5 years of 'Good luck, there's no money left, hahaha!' Labour, and you, you numpty fruitcake, want to put Ed 'Hell yeah' Milliband in the fucking drivers seat who can't even remember the deficit exists when giving a speech at his own party conference.

As I already said. I'm not a 'numpty fruitcake'.

UKIP on course to hold onto just one seat apparently, although that doesn't take into account the closet racist factor. Because of FPTP I don't think the Greens will get any more than what they already have.

I honestly think UKIP will make a big dent in safe Tory seats. Probably not enough to gain seats, but definitely shrink a few majorities.

Sadly, I can also see them gaining in places where the BNP usually bubble under like South Yorkshire and Lancashire. Again, not enough to gain seats, but enough to crow about a "mandate from the silent majority" or some shit.

UKIP 2 or 3, Greens 1. That's what'll happen.

I think the debates have not helped Farage.

Its interesting to read some of the more right wing leaning forums on the web. Pistonheads love UKIP for example, and think he has killed it each time he has been on.
I have no idea how many people think like them across the country, but it's a large forum.

I have no idea how things are going to play out, I suspect it'll be a hung parliament, and it'll all depend on whether a Con/LD/DUP coalition has enough seats to take it.

You could also try not tarring all UKIP supporters with the same brush by calling them racists. But obviously, that's just what some of you lefty dickheads feel fine doing on this forum, whereas I get criticised when I call SNP supporters a bunch of morons. Standard hypocrisy. And calling someone an idiot is much less of an offensive presumption than calling someone racist. UKIP supporters might actually just believe we're better off out of Europe, for which there is a political/economical argument to be made. At least I'm not poncing around parading some kind of SJW standard that I don't even adhere to myself. And I'm not so mentally fragile that I need to put everyone I don't like on an ignore list so I can pretend ignorance of their opinions. Fucking hell, I don't even know why I post here. With Cavey having had enough there's barely anything worth reading.

I reckon UKIP 4-6 MPs minimum, it all depends how the swings go.

Yeah, people not wanting to read your posts must be entirely because they disagree with your political stance; there couldn't possible be any other reason.

@EBG I'm still here mate, sort of. Don't go!

@Bamba Hell, we all get exasperated and pissed off from time to time; sometimes it's difficult to keep your cool (I'm guilty of this too; I humbly suggest EBG and me aren't the only ones!)

Yes, I realise things can get heated but that string of invective I quoted there was a single post! And it's hardly uncharacteristic of EBJs ranting on this thread and elsewhere. Obviously he can post in whatever style he wants but to claim that his political opinions are the sole reason people might not want to engage with him is a difficult argument to make.

To be slightly fair, while I disagree with EBG and Cavey on most of their political opinions, Cobracure did I believe originally, in what appears to now have been edited out of the post, call everyone who votes Tory a self-serving cunt. Invective isn't just onesided.

In defence of Cobracure, I am most definitely a self-serving cunt.

But yes, the current state of politics has me in a constant state of exasperation. That and the fact I think anything further than centre-left is doolally head-in-clouds mental.

I think the majority of people are actually bang on central, but there isn't a party that caters for that.

Better that than a BNP-lite UKIP racist.

I love this thread.

You'd love it less if you read Twitter.

Grow up, everyone.

No, YOU grow up.

Really? To Twitter I go!

(who should I be following?)

Sorry I can't pay attention to anything unless it's said in blue.

Bloody Tories!

http://m.thetelegraphandargus.co.uk/new ... ford_West/

Ken Livingston helps out in Bradford.

What made you decide to vote ukip, Gnomes?

I'm not convinced he said he would, unless I missed it.

Apologies , then. I am misunderstanding.

Indeed I didn't, and I never would I think. I think the issue of Europe needs to be put to a referendum, where various parties can make their arguments about it, and then we'll vote on it and put it to bed either way. That's a Conservative promise for 2017.

I don't however think UKIP are the raging racists that the lazy reductionists here would have you believe, although it's perfectly likely that some genuine racialists that want 'those nasty foreigners out' think that UKIP is the party that represents them. There are loads of people who vote for parties without really knowing what it is they stand for. Racism not actually represented in their stated objectives of the party, and wanting to reduce immigration from various sources doesn't make you a racist. Neither does thinking that people wanting to come and live here to work must actually have some skills that we need. I'm happy to listen to arguments for an Australian-like points system. It's also fine to think that people that want to come here and not work and suckle off what they think is our easy welfare system should piss off.

Detractors who say such conniving mercenary immigrants don't exist, then great. There's no problem then, and any measured policy to exclude them won't apply to genuine folk. Or perhaps you think immigration should be reduced because of the problem of housing stock, where we seemingly can't build enough homes to even house all of those coming in whether they're genuine or not. If you believe these things on that basic principle, then I have no issue with it.

But obviously, as usual, any support for a notion that happens to be in line with what UKIP say they think will have me accused of both actively supporting UKIP and being a secret racist. Little wonder I get frustrated and just end up calling people idiotic fucking twats.

UKIP serve a function. They're making other parties react and tackle issues they'd have rather swept under the rug despite it clearly being a concern of millions of the public that want it addressed in some way. That's great, but I wouldn't vote for a single-issue party, not least because their popularity has seen them trying to backfill policy in other areas to bulk out their manifesto. Far too wishy washy.

Heh. Christopher Eccles cakes is supporting the register to vote push. Entertainingly BBC news refers to him being the "Doctor Who actor" regularly. He'll love that.

The Green Party have done a fine job of picking someone with as little widespread appeal as possible where I live.
He's a 50 year old poet called Spoz with a silly haircut.

I'm sure he'll appeal to the stereotypical soap dodging green supporter but it has to be a huge turn off for the wider population.

Apparently, it is £750 a day to travel on the Lib Dem battle bus! £750!

I'll throw in a fiver to a fund to get EBG on there for a day

Is there anywhere you can see published routes of where the parties are touring? I'd be tempted to pop along for a nose.

For your money, you do get to hear a fine rendition of 'Nearer my God to thee'.

Gnomes!

Here's a question that I was thinking over last night, and some Wikipedia-ing suggests it may be a valid thought (to a degree). The presumption is that in Scotland, the election is going to be a straight SNP/Labour fight. Conservatives of course don't have a real presence there, 1 seat in 2010. However, 17% of the vote and some wealthy constituencies where that will be higher.

However - if we take the Conservative popularity in Scotland as not increasing, we can possibly assume that all Tory voters in 2010 are hardcore voters who are unlikely to be shifted in 2015 (other than to UKIP). Therefore the SNP/Labour battle is potentially only over those who voted SNP/Labour in 2010.

Therefore Tory vote stays steady, and Labour/SNP fight over the same voter base. Does this increase the possibility of Tories winning seats due to the two competitors splitting the vote? Could be a significant factor, as every seat won by Conservatives in Scotland means another two seats that Labour needs in England to run with a Labour/SNP coalition.

The SNP have great organisational advantages and have been able to capitalise on the momentum from the referendum. The impression I've had of Scottish Labour is that for many years it has taken its voters for granted, been a bastion of brutal infighting, and let its organisational structures deteriorate.

Haven't these people heard of Megabus? It's 12 quid return from Sheffield to London.

Work experience lackey tells the Guardian why he has not even registered to vote. Good luck with your credit score.