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The Force Awakens: Spoiler-riddled Thread
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Author:  KovacsC [ Thu Dec 17, 2015 14:04 ]
Post subject:  The Force Awakens: Spoiler-riddled Thread
Only me so far.... ?
Author:  Mr Dave [ Thu Dec 17, 2015 14:05 ]
Post subject:  Re: The Force Awakens: Spoiler-riddled Thread
I haven't seen it. if that helps.
Author:  KovacsC [ Thu Dec 17, 2015 14:32 ]
Post subject:  Re: The Force Awakens: Spoiler-riddled Thread
Can hardly talk about it with someone not seen it
Author:  lasermink [ Thu Dec 17, 2015 14:36 ]
Post subject:  Re: The Force Awakens: Spoiler-riddled Thread
I haven't seen it either. Terribly sorry.
Author:  KovacsC [ Thu Dec 17, 2015 14:39 ]
Post subject:  Re: The Force Awakens: Spoiler-riddled Thread
Dammit.... :)
Author:  Bluecup [ Thu Dec 17, 2015 14:45 ]
Post subject:  Re: The Force Awakens: Spoiler-riddled Thread
I've seen it. Can't believe Chewbacca turned his back on his Dad like that.
Author:  KovacsC [ Thu Dec 17, 2015 14:47 ]
Post subject:  Re: The Force Awakens: Spoiler-riddled Thread
his dad?
Author:  Mr Dave [ Thu Dec 17, 2015 14:50 ]
Post subject:  Re: The Force Awakens: Spoiler-riddled Thread
Chewbaccas such an ungrateful twat.
Author:  Bluecup [ Thu Dec 17, 2015 14:53 ]
Post subject:  Re: The Force Awakens: Spoiler-riddled Thread
Mr Dave wrote:
Chewbaccas such an ungrateful twat.

He really really is. Leaving his family behind and only turning up on Life Day and expecting the world. Bastard.
Author:  JBR [ Thu Dec 17, 2015 17:26 ]
Post subject:  Re: The Force Awakens: Spoiler-riddled Thread
I saw it last night. I'll spoiler tag, despite title of thread.

ZOMG Spoiler! Click here to view!
Man, they went overboard on the plummy Brit accents - I realise that's an homage to the originals, but it seemed intrusive to me. And Daisy's voice really grated with me; her looking at bit like Keira Knightley (I'm in the 'weirdly punchable face' camp about her) didn't help. Perhaps there's some point to that, that she is linked with the other poshoes later, but it just meant I couldn't warm to her.
Author:  KovacsC [ Thu Dec 17, 2015 18:06 ]
Post subject:  Re: The Force Awakens: Spoiler-riddled Thread
I hardly noticed the accents, I might do when I see it again..

I thought the plot moved in a good pace, ok not a great plot.
Author:  JBR [ Thu Dec 17, 2015 19:04 ]
Post subject:  Re: The Force Awakens: Spoiler-riddled Thread
Yeah - more interesting early on than late, unless you failed to see that death coming.
Author:  Pundabaya [ Thu Dec 17, 2015 19:56 ]
Post subject:  Re: The Force Awakens: Spoiler-riddled Thread
I haven't seen it, but I've got the gist off various Internet sources... is it supposed to be a surprise that the baddie is Han Solo's son? I mean come on.... it was either going to be Solo Jr or Skywalker. Once we saw the dudes not remotely Skywalker face...
Author:  Bamba [ Thu Dec 17, 2015 20:04 ]
Post subject:  Re: The Force Awakens: Spoiler-riddled Thread
Pundabaya wrote:
I haven't seen it, but I've got the gist off various Internet sources... is it supposed to be a surprise that the baddie is Han Solo's son? I mean come on.... it was either going to be Solo Jr or Skywalker. Once we saw the dudes not remotely Skywalker face...


It's revealed pretty early on that's who he is and alluded to even before that so I doing think it's intended to be some central mystery or anything.
Author:  KovacsC [ Thu Dec 17, 2015 23:54 ]
Post subject:  Re: The Force Awakens: Spoiler-riddled Thread
I think Rey is his sister
Author:  Trooper [ Fri Dec 18, 2015 0:36 ]
Post subject:  Re: The Force Awakens: Spoiler-riddled Thread
I really enjoyed it. Sure, it's basically a homage to the original, but it's done really really well. The sound effects and score were just lovely. Ren's voice was chilling, his lightsaber was dirty, the falcon sounded great.
It was fun and funny in places, BB-8 was the right side of cute. The two main leads played off each other really well, despite the script being a bit lacking in places.
It was very predictable, but it was actually exciting to watch and the first hour flew by. Lost a bit of steam towards the end, and then just... ended.
The worst/most amusing part was the build up to Ren taking his helmet off, this big scary badas... oh... is it that whiny teen Parker from Gold Rush?...

8.5 thumbs out of x
Author:  MrChris [ Fri Dec 18, 2015 0:39 ]
Post subject:  Re: The Force Awakens: Spoiler-riddled Thread
Yes, that gets alluded to very early on.

Bloody hell though, killing off han?! Sam was in tears. I was expecting it to be chewie.

Overall, very good film, great visuals, great characters, great dialogue, good story. Mostly agree with troops. Will be watching again multiple times.
Author:  Bluecup [ Fri Dec 18, 2015 0:42 ]
Post subject:  Re: The Force Awakens: Spoiler-riddled Thread
Silent Kovacs wrote:
I think Rey is his sister

Given the symmetry with A New Hope and that there is no way they could resist the obvious call back in the next film, I think she is his cousin.
Author:  KovacsC [ Fri Dec 18, 2015 8:18 ]
Post subject:  Re: The Force Awakens: Spoiler-riddled Thread
Bluecup wrote:
Silent Kovacs wrote:
I think Rey is his sister

Given the symmetry with A New Hope and that there is no way they could resist the obvious call back in the next film, I think she is his cousin.


I don't think it is Luke's kid.. The sabre called to her, but it was Anikins.
Author:  MrChris [ Fri Dec 18, 2015 9:24 ]
Post subject:  Re: The Force Awakens: Spoiler-riddled Thread
It was Anakin's and then Luke's though, wasn't it?
Author:  KovacsC [ Fri Dec 18, 2015 9:37 ]
Post subject:  Re: The Force Awakens: Spoiler-riddled Thread
LeChris wrote:
It was Anakin's and then Luke's though, wasn't it?



Yes it is the one Ben gave look in a new hope.

Hence I think Rey is Leia's it looks to to be the same ship flying away when she was left, that Leia arrived in when she saw Han.
Author:  Derek The Halls [ Fri Dec 18, 2015 11:59 ]
Post subject:  Re: The Force Awakens: Spoiler-riddled Thread
I figured brother and sister too.
Author:  MrChris [ Fri Dec 18, 2015 12:30 ]
Post subject:  Re: The Force Awakens: Spoiler-riddled Thread
Nah, otherwise Han and Leia might have mentioned the missing daughter too.

I reckon Rey is Luke's kid. Remember that Kylo Ren saw that she had been having dreams about Luke Skywalker on an island in a big ocean.

Can't wait for this to be out on Bluray.
Author:  Bamba [ Fri Dec 18, 2015 13:32 ]
Post subject:  Re: The Force Awakens: Spoiler-riddled Thread
I got pretty confused about what was going on when she touched the light sabre and got that flurry of images, anyone want to explain that lot?
Author:  Derek The Halls [ Fri Dec 18, 2015 13:38 ]
Post subject:  Re: The Force Awakens: Spoiler-riddled Thread
She was experiencing family history. The Force showed it to her.
Author:  Hearthly [ Fri Dec 18, 2015 14:31 ]
Post subject:  Re: The Force Awakens: Spoiler-riddled Thread
They kill off Han?

I guess Ford only wanted to come back for one film or something. Plus it mitigates the risk of him dying for real before the next one I suppose.
Author:  KovacsC [ Fri Dec 18, 2015 14:33 ]
Post subject:  Re: The Force Awakens: Spoiler-riddled Thread
Hearthly wrote:
They kill off Han?

I guess Ford only wanted to come back for one film or something. Plus it mitigates the risk of him dying for real before the next one I suppose.


Yes...
Author:  Hearthly [ Fri Dec 18, 2015 14:39 ]
Post subject:  Re: The Force Awakens: Spoiler-riddled Thread
Silent Kovacs wrote:
Yes...


I'm really quite surprised, although I'm not sure why, I just had it in my head that since they got 'THE BIG THREE' back from the original trilogy they'd keep them around for a bit.

I bet Ford just wanted Han to get killed off because Lucas wouldn't help it happen in ROTJ, so it was worth him coming back for that.
Author:  JBR [ Fri Dec 18, 2015 14:53 ]
Post subject:  Re: The Force Awakens: Spoiler-riddled Thread
Plus it helps to put the focus on the new characters without the old ones around, reminding everyone where it all comes from. I think it worked pretty well in that way - even allowing for the thought 'what have you done to your face?!' coming into my head every time Carrie Fisher appeared on screen. It seemed a good mix of old and new, but with the exciting things happening with the new characters. I'll even take a bit more of the ginger general, though he could tone the accent down a bit. Much better when he was shouting and power crazed.
Author:  KovacsC [ Fri Dec 18, 2015 15:13 ]
Post subject:  Re: The Force Awakens: Spoiler-riddled Thread
Hearthly wrote:
Silent Kovacs wrote:
Yes...


I'm really quite surprised, although I'm not sure why, I just had it in my head that since they got 'THE BIG THREE' back from the original trilogy they'd keep them around for a bit.

I bet Ford just wanted Han to get killed off because Lucas wouldn't help it happen in ROTJ, so it was worth him coming back for that.


Perhaps try watching the film :)
Author:  myp [ Fri Dec 18, 2015 18:54 ]
Post subject:  Re: The Force Awakens: Spoiler-riddled Thread
I have done seen this now. Got dragged along by some friends. It was pretty good. Started to realise why I used to love Star Wars originally again now, but it's going to take a while to fully get back into it. Disowning the prequel trilogy is a start. I'm going to pretend they don't exist at all as events that happen in those sort of ruin stuff from the other four.
Author:  myp [ Fri Dec 18, 2015 19:03 ]
Post subject:  Re: The Force Awakens: Spoiler-riddled Thread
Happy to say I avoided all spoilers and didn't even watch a trailer. So it was all new to me! That certainly helped. I didn't even really make an effort either.
Author:  Dr Zoidberg [ Fri Dec 18, 2015 23:04 ]
Post subject:  Re: The Force Awakens: Spoiler-riddled Thread
This seemed to do a fine job of ignoring the prequels.

I really enjoyed it.
Author:  nickachu [ Sat Dec 19, 2015 1:59 ]
Post subject:  Re: The Force Awakens: Spoiler-riddled Thread
It was bloody good.

Sets up the next two films pretty well I guess, I imagine luke is gonna be a big part of the next film at least, and Kylo Ren was a good bad guy, just filled with anger, no real control over what he's doing, he'll get trained by Darth Jar Jar and become a master leading to a final showdown between Rey and Ren at the end of the 3rd movie. Also BB-8 was awesome, the thumbs up was one of my favourite bits.
Author:  Trousers [ Mon Dec 21, 2015 8:47 ]
Post subject:  Re: The Force Awakens: Spoiler-riddled Thread
I saw this last night and I was disappointed. Much like Jurassic World it seemed intent on going over the same ground of the earlier movie to the detriment of the current movie.

Start on desert planet, quirky droid with hologram plans, person on desert planet with latent jedi powers, green and fertile Rebel base, important character dies near end, latent jedi and bad guy separated by contrivance ex machina, huge fuck off planet killing thing with handy boss fight weakness etc etc

I enjoyed it don't get me wrong but every single one of those significant nods to the past just dragged me out of the film so I could go "OH LOOK FLOATING DRONE THINGY" or "COR, HOLOGRAM CHESS MONSTERY THING".

I hope JJ Abrams feels like he has paid enough homage to the past and just gets on with his own film next time.
Author:  Hearthly [ Mon Dec 21, 2015 11:30 ]
Post subject:  Re: The Force Awakens: Spoiler-riddled Thread
I believe it's a different director for the next one, the guy who did LOOPER is what I heard.
Author:  Cavey [ Mon Dec 21, 2015 12:09 ]
Post subject:  Re: The Force Awakens: Spoiler-riddled Thread
I'm not a massive Star Wars fan (and I thought all the 'modern' ones were ridiculously and laughably over-hyped, badly written garbage), but saw this with my sons in laws last night at the IMAX, and it was enjoyable enough. I quite liked it.

As Trousers said, though, distinct feeling of deja vu in terms of plot/storyline/setting/Deathstar etc., and for me, they tried to cram a little too much into the storyline, just a little too much pace and not enough depth? I'll probably get shot down for saying it but JJ Abrams is "Mister Lightweight" for me - just look what he done did to Star Trek's The Wrath of Khan...

BB8 is dead cute though.
Author:  MrChris [ Mon Dec 21, 2015 12:36 ]
Post subject:  Re: The Force Awakens: Spoiler-riddled Thread
Jurassic World was ace, you loony, Trousers.

Cavey - I loved Into Darkness :) Ultimately I know what you mean though - I think JJ did a slightly more sturdy job with Star Trek 1 than he did with Star Wars in terms of depth.
Author:  Dr Zoidberg [ Mon Dec 21, 2015 14:00 ]
Post subject:  Re: The Force Awakens: Spoiler-riddled Thread
On one hand the plot and structure were fairly similar to ANH which isn't as satisfying as a completely fresh storyline would have been, but on the other it was still damn good fun.
Lets face it, it's main job here was to not be shit and rehabilitate the franchise, and it did that very well. It's introduced some very likeable new characters, saw a good reduction in scale (more is not better) and entertained people for a couple of hours.

There's clearly quite a lot that's happened off-screen after ROTJ, some of which I expect will be filled in in the next two films, but probably also in tie-in material in other formats.

The biggest question is how the rebels have gone from apparently winning the war against the empire and forming a new government back to a handful of ships parked on Greenham Common.

What's it like in IMAX 3D? I'm tempted to double dip on this one and may as well go large.
Author:  myp [ Mon Dec 21, 2015 14:13 ]
Post subject:  Re: The Force Awakens: Spoiler-riddled Thread
LeChris wrote:
Jurassic World was ace, you loony, Trousers.

It was pretty good, not a patch on the original though and therein lies the problem. I enjoyed Into Darkness on first watch, but it just doesn't mesh as a film. Even Abrams has stated his disappointment with it.
Author:  NervousPete [ Mon Dec 21, 2015 14:49 ]
Post subject:  Re: The Force Awakens: Spoiler-riddled Thread
Here be me thoughts!

As far as the opening third goes, if it had maintained that quality I think it would have been the second best Star Wars film after Empire. I loved the slow, leisurely burn of the opening; lots to see and think about but some great day-to-day existence in the Star Wars 'verse. From the opening shot of the edge of the destroyer crossing the moon to the malevolently humming buzz of a laser blast frozen in mid air, through to the completely gorgeous slide down the vast sand dune in the shadow of a crashed Star Destroyer the director brought beauty and awe back to Star Wars. In fact, I think he went further than even Empire did with the quality of that early direction.

Unfortunately he doesn't quite last the course, but the entire film still holds up and there's marvels to be found throughout its entire runtime. In order of hurrah I'd list the characters in the following order...

Finn, a character sorely needed in the Star Wars universe. An exuberant innocent who has no grand talents, but a good heart. Superb performance from Boyega, I loved him from the start, when he cradled a dying storm-trooper.

Rei; no-nonsense, practical, spirited and ever struggling to hide her fear. I love how she bounces off Finn, and has her own odd moment of silliness.

Kylo Ren: I was surprised how much I enjoyed him, and he was given something of a thankless task. To be a sullen, immature, rebellious teenager who kills the most beloved character in the Star Wars franchise? That's a ballsy move. Fortunately the actor balances it all with a nice dose of humour and pathos, and sets up a real question of whether he could ever be redeemed.

Han Solo: Not as high on your list, but this is less a detriment to Ford's work than a signifier of how hard the newbies were working. To be honest I was a little unsure about him in his opening scene, I feel he played it a little too broad, but he got better as the film went on and as I came to accept the interpretation of the character. Here's the important thing that J.J did, he acknowledged that they're weren't the same people. No one is after thirty years. Everyone changes, Leia, Han... only C3P0 remains the same, red arm or no. If anything I'd have liked an extra down-time scene with Han, at the bar perhaps, talking with Finn or Rei about his time drifting, just a little more to add weight to the intervening years.

Poe Dameron: I totally thought this was going to be disposable new guy killed off just to show that the bad guys are bad. But no, big new supporting character in his own right and I was surprised to find myself very happy that he made it out of there and had a part to play in the finale. Plucky, fun character.

BB8: Aw. He's cute. The eternal question that will divide fandom though, as it did our pub based post-film dissection: Is BB8 giving Finn a thumbs up or flipping him off?

General Hux: Man, what a giant douche. Wonderfully sneering, worthy baddie.

Leia: I wish she worked better, I really did. She wasn't bad, had some nice moments in fact and a quite touching scene. But she hasn't acted in a long while and it shows. She's a writer first, not an actress. Dig the character though.

Snoke: Eh, just some big bad. Not particularly interesting, I guess he didn't have to be really. I'm not sure the First Order should have had an evil Sith Emperor, it might have worked better with a more traditional fascist dictator. Here's hoping he's actually a four foot tall bearded showman and operating a big hologram from behind a curtain.

So, overall a heck of a lot of fun. It brings a real earthiness back to Star Wars, and the universe they're in feels infinitely more relatable and grounded than the prequel one. You can imagine them digging their hands in the sand, waking up tired, weary. I love the First Order, the way they operate, as if they're trying to recapture past glories but unsure as to how. The new storm-troopers are brilliant, a real threat and a pleasure to watch. Also more human, and I love that they aren't clones anymore. As to the resistance, it is actually understandable how small an operation they are - but it's something that the film commits its biggest sin on...

Failing to explain how the First Order, the resistance and the New Republic relate. I did a bit of research and it turns out that the New Republic is what emerged following a year long civil war mopping up the remnants of the Imperial fleets after they retreated following RotJ, the final big battle being around the planet Jakka. (Which is why we get the crashed imperial ships.) The survivors fled to the outer rim, almost uncharted space, renamed itself the First Order and licked its wounds. The New Republic went back to doing its hilariously-ineffective schtick whilst Leia tried to warn everyone that the First Order were still a danger. As a smaller power as compared to the vast New Republic, the new superpower didn't take the First Order at all seriously and were content to contain them in that lawless outer rim rather than face a new war. However, certain planets within the senate did take Leia seriously and so decided to fund a small movement on her part designed to keep tabs on the First Order, hit them with spoiling attacks and generally disrupt their plans. This group she bafflingly names 'The Resistance', when they're a lot more like the LotR/Babylon 5 'rangers'. This is why they only have a few ships, they aren't the New Republic Army.

And so the First Order, holding a beef against the New Republic, are further antagonised by the resistance, and thus have a real nark on when they hit them with the super-weapon. The planets destroyed I have also found out to be the new capital of the Republic, the Hossini system, where they moved to following the fall of Coruscant.

Somewhat unforgivably none of this is said in the movie, but apparently it's all in a tie in novel or comic or something. If only there was a device the Star Wars films had where this knowledge could be imparted, perhaps at the start of the film, eh? I really dislike this strategy by franchises, everything important to the film should be in the film. Don't make me buy a comic.

There's some other bungles too - the map of Luke's whereabouts was mishandled somewhat, as it was never said how Max Von Sydow got this information in the first place. Plus the R2D2 just waking up thing struck me as being fairly lazy - he should have been with Luke and the map onus was on the resistance's efforts. At several points in the movie I really felt it needed to stop a moment and just flesh out a critical piece of information, even with just a line or two. I don't know if it was edited down so more screenings could be fitted into the day or what, but this film could really benefit from a director's cut.

In all then I really liked it. The new characters really make the film something special, the acting is fun, there's a lot of joy and awe and little moments of beauty in it. I really, really, really hated, hated Super 8 and Into Darkness so this is a welcome relief to me. I do think that Abrams is a gifted director when his heart is in it, but he can't tell a good script from a weak one and he's definitely not an ideas man. Fortunately the twists on old things kept this fresh. I was surprised how much I enjoyed the new Death Star - um, Star Killer. There was a real menace to it, the way it took time for the beam to reach it's target, and everyone knew what was about to befall them. The awe-inspiring idea of living on a weapon planet, with a small continent sized gun muzzle. All those pine trees flexing and bending with the shot. Ooh. Coolness. Of course, complete nonsense - how could people on other planets see the light of the beam crossing space as it happened? Whither art thou speed of light? But eh, who cares? I'd throw a fit if this was Star Trek but Star Wars is fantasy, and thus it is forgivable.

Yup, good stuff. Rei and Finn ftw! Most of all I'm glad it's brought evil British sideburned middle management back to Star Wars.

4/5
Author:  Doctor Glyndwr [ Mon Dec 21, 2015 14:58 ]
Post subject:  Re: The Force Awakens: Spoiler-riddled Thread
Re: Pete's backstory fill-in, there, this is from the Visual Dictionary, a tie-in book.
Author:  Dr Zoidberg [ Mon Dec 21, 2015 15:00 ]
Post subject:  Re: The Force Awakens: Spoiler-riddled Thread
NervousPete wrote:
Somewhat unforgivably none of this is said in the movie, but apparently it's all in a tie in novel or comic or something. If only there was a device the Star Wars films had where this knowledge could be imparted, perhaps at the start of the film, eh? I really dislike this strategy by franchises, everything important to the film should be in the film. Don't make me buy a comic.


I agree - it's very much the done thing these days to have supplementary/companion/whatever parts of the story in other media but that should be where you add extra information for those that want to see a bit more of the franchise rather than key plot points.
Author:  DavPaz [ Tue Dec 22, 2015 1:12 ]
Post subject:  Re: The Force Awakens: Spoiler-riddled Thread
You know who else looks like Kiera Knightly?

Natalie Portman. Just saying
Author:  myp [ Tue Dec 22, 2015 2:00 ]
Post subject:  Re: The Force Awakens: Spoiler-riddled Thread
Curio is a prick
Author:  Curiosity [ Wed Dec 23, 2015 18:06 ]
Post subject:  Re: The Force Awakens: Spoiler-riddled Thread
Festive Warrior wrote:
Curio is a prick


Hah.

Loved the movie. Finn and Rey are great.
Author:  Zardoz [ Sun Dec 27, 2015 20:59 ]
Post subject:  Re: The Force Awakens: Spoiler-riddled Thread
Just watched it. Really enjoyed it.

Thank fuck it wasn't anything like I, II & III. Was great seeing it with my kids (we had recently watched all the other films together), they knew who all the old characters were (I helped them with Leia) and understood the story. I was choked myself when my daughter cried over Han.
Author:  Mimi [ Sun Dec 27, 2015 21:13 ]
Post subject:  Re: The Force Awakens: Spoiler-riddled Thread
DavPaz wrote:
You know who else looks like Kiera Knightly?

Natalie Portman. Just saying

I thought they were the same person for years, and I windered why the hybrid actress could only act in 50% of films and was awful in the others.
Author:  MaliA [ Sun Dec 27, 2015 21:16 ]
Post subject:  Re: The Force Awakens: Spoiler-riddled Thread
Loved it. Tripped over it's feet slightly towards the end but caught up well. Almost cried with happiness during the dogfights.

MrsA thinks Rei is Luke's daughter due to lightsaber calling her and R2D2 woke up after detecting her on the planet.
Author:  Cras [ Sun Dec 27, 2015 21:36 ]
Post subject:  Re: The Force Awakens: Spoiler-riddled Thread
The common consensus is that she probably is, but I'd love it if they gave us a twist there and made her someone else's kid
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